Jan Angilella
Katherine Barna
Grace Huh
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Unityman1966. First and foremost there is no such a monster as a "Gay Christian". Secondly, the scripture that you quoted you did as so many do today. You misquoted it! and as a result your understanding is torqued a bit. Allow me.
2 Corinthians 3:6 (King James Version)
Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life. (NOT LIGHT)
You see the spirit gives "LIFE", Not the DEATH SENTENCE that was carved in letters upon tables of stone. You took one misquoted scripture and attempt to biblically justify homosexuality. Allow me to provide the entire conversation that Paul was having with the Corinthian believers, A little history will help you. You see back in first Corinthians Paul wrote a letter to the believers in Corinth and he slammed them hard about a man who was sleeping with his Dad's wife. Paul was outraged, beside himself, totaly miffed at these believers who just stood by and watched this affair go on un-checked. In a nut shell, Paul was very hard on the young band of believers, even to the point that many of these believers took offense to Pauls stern rebuke. You will find this in the 5th chapter of 1st Corinthians. You will also note that many of the young believers were contentious and boasting about who they were baptized by. As if this were important in the eyes of the Lord. At the end of 1st Corinthians Paul promised to come to them, but before he had a chance he penned 2nd Corinthians and set about smoothing the road to that visit. Not that he would take back anything he said but that he would confirm his previous words and charge that young group of believers to know that he did not want to come to them in heaviness of heart brought on by the last letter he had written. Paul declared to them that forgiveness is essential, and anybody they forgive he forgives. In the passage we have open for discussion Paul simply stated that he was not a minister of the letter of the law, but a minister, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart. And this is why Paul wanted to drive the point home about his commission. His commission was not written with ink, legalistic, but spiritual thus you have the scripture you misquoted...."And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward: Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God; Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
Now to address to "Gay Christian". This is absolutely a term born in the bowels of hell. It drips with the poison of damnation and destruction to anyone who bares such an awfull title. Paul addressed homosexuality in a letter to the Romans. A little history will help here as well. You should no that by the letter of Roman Law Paul was a citizen of Rome. Acts 22:27-28 The commander went to Paul and asked, "Tell me, are you a Roman citizen?" "Yes, I am," he answered.Then the commander said, "I had to pay a big price for my citizenship."
"But I was born a citizen," Paul replied. You should know that Paul being a Roman citizen he was very familure with the culture and social envirorment and was well rehersed in the "while in Rome do like the Romans" ideaology. And as paul always does in any of his letters he has true grit and stands against the multitudes and confronts the issue head on.. Want to hear what he said?
Romans Chapter 1 Verses 26-27
For this reason God gave them over and abandoned them to vile affections and degrading passions. For their women exchanged their natural function for an unnatural and abnormal one,
And the men also turned from natural relations with women and were set ablaze (burning out, consumed) with lust for one another--men committing shameful acts with men and suffering in their own bodies and personalities the inevitable consequences and penalty of their wrong-doing and going astray, which was [their] fitting retribution.
My friend, you can twist and manipulate scripture in your mind to justify any activity. And I mean any activity, but I know in my heart of hearts that you are not designed to spend eternity in bondage to any one thing. In fact I know that you were created to spend eternity with the Lord Jesus. I will prove it...
1st Timothy 2 1-4
I urge, then, first of all, that requests, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for everyone—for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. This is good, and pleases God our Savior, who wants all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.
You see, God desires that you be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth. I do not know your real name, but I do know that God is bigger than that lack of information. My prayers are for you and many other in your situation. Lost.. Just like I was at one time. There is no Hell for thieves and another for murderers and another for homosexuals. There is one hell, One God, One Jesus Christ, one salvation for you and it was bought with the blood of a man, on a cursed cross over 2000 years ago. Choose Him, Choose LIFE.
My prayers go out for you, and it is my sincere hope that you are found by Him, and that I will see you in glory.
In closing I would to confirm for you one truth that you got right and you interpreted it literally. We are in fact in for some perilous times... Check this out...
Matthew 24
1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
In His Grip
RKL
Unityman1966 you have chosen the wide path that leads to destruction. many there be that go therein (Matt 7:13-14). You have chosen to agree with the spirit of the age, and the spirit of the antichrist speaking through the writer of this piece of filth, and have chosen to disregard, and close your ears to Him who now speaks from Heaven through His Son the Lord Jesus Christ (Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
Heb 12:25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:). Clearly you need to recognize, and come into agreement with Christ that Homosexuality is Sin, repent of that sin, and receive Salvation. How do I know that you are not saved (converted) by this (2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity). Keep this in mind: Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. The Lord is just, faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and cleanse us from of our iniquity, but we must be obedient to repent first. I pray that you do so.
As a gay Christian, I think this article hits the proverbial nail on the head! If you take everything the Christian bible says word for word verbatum, we are all in for a world of trouble. The bible was written over many lifetimes by many authors, some who never actually knew Jesus.Also, the many translations and control by the Roman Catholic Church over the centuries have made it a source of power and control.A great author I would suggest reading on the subject is John Shelby Spong.
My understanding is that the origional intent of the quoted scripures in the previous response by mmsandberg was to warn against the dangers of promiscuity and sex as an "idol". In the context of the times in which the often quoted scriptures against homosexuality were written it was very common for wealthy leaders to have young male servants who they used for sex. This is what I believe the Bible addresses.
Simply reading something with no understanding of the historical and social context in which it was written is a huge misunderstanding of intent.
The Bible also says " The letter killeth , but the Spirit givith Light". I think that educated people are awakening to the fact that long held beliefs that someone tells them has to be true "because I said (or "God" said) so, does not hold up in the light of an awakening Truth.
God is Love and that is the key. Gay people and Straight people alike struggle with the same things and everyone wants to be loved. How that Love is expressed should not be an issue.
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I know others have stated it but I will as well. Paul in the book of Romans speaks against Homosexuality (Romans 1: 25-28) He says that people who live a homosexual lifestyle have chosen to live their lives alone without God. Rom. 1:21 says that God let them go over to their human knowledge and understanding of the world. Living by their desires not in truth. Pauls says in V25 that for those people the truth of God has been twisted and changed into a lie. Pauls says that God gave them up to their desires and in V 21 he speaks specifially against the act of lust between two men or two women. Does this mean that God does not love them? No, it simply means that they have chosen to live a life without God, and as such will live in eternity without God. Is it too late for them? No because (John 3:16) God loved the world so much that he sent his son to die for our sins so we don't have to, and it says that we get to heaven by faith not works. It also states that if we truly have faith in Jesus our lives will be an axample of how Jesus lived. However, you must live your life serving God and accepting Jesus. Once you accept Jesus your sins are remembered no more, this does mean that you turn from your sin and turn to Jesus. The Bible is not a message of Hate. It is a message of truth and love, and as Christians we should show our love to everyone regardless of their sin. Let us not forget that Jesus hung out with prostitutes, drunks, tax collectors, and he called Paul, a man who killed hundreds of Christians, to be one of his apostles which also wrote 14 books of the bible.
des_sniper, not all Christians have the judmental, etc attitude you describe, although I understand there are ones who do. I believe in God and Jesus Christ but don't see the world that way. Please ignore the people who have this approach to life, because it's not what God and Jesus are all about. It really is all about unconditional love, and the "Golden Rule", and truth.
I am sorry but the New Testament does talk about Homosexuality. Romans 1:24, 25,26,27,28,29. "For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. Likewise also the men leaving the natural use of the woman burned in their lust for one another men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving into themselves the penalty of their error which was due. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge he gave them over to a debased mind to do those things which are not fitting." The bible doesn't accept homosexuality, period! The bible is more than religious philosophy and spiritual truths. It is a HOLY scripture.
If you are talking about the New Testament, it doesn't mention homosexuality. If you believe the Old Testament, then you must also agree that polygamy, incest, and slavery are ok. Hell, there's a whole chapter devoted to advice on how to handle your slaves! Also, you can't eat fat and you must be executed if you work on a Sunday. Also, you must stone your children if they are stubborn.
Either you believe all of it or you don't. So have fun stoning your children after having sex with them.
Also, if you think marriage's only purpose is procreation, then i guess it should be illegal for a man and woman to marry if they are no longer of child bearing age. And if one spouse turns out to be infertile, then I guess they should get divorced.
Wow, Lisa Miller you are bankrupt. You twist the scripture to your own destruction and lead the unlearned down the path of eternal damanation. Newsweek in my opinion should never have let this article be published. This shows they definitely know nothing about scripture. To those who read it call no man (kind) your master; seek the truth on your own; if you are interested in knowing God. This article perverts the word of God once delivered to the saints to hide sin. Alot of you tout God's love, God does not condemn the sinner, but he emphatically attacks sin. You cannot justify the sin of Homosexuality anymore than murder, adultery, fornication, or the rest that are mentioned in Galations Chapter 5. Read 2 Timothy the scripture are of no private interpretation. The word of God is clear, accept it now and repent, that means to sin no more. My people perish for lack of knowledge.
Sorry, I didn't mean to repeat myself. Parts of my comment pasted in twice. Mea culpa.
Uh, "wwagnac", did you READ the article to which you are responding? Have you bothered to reread the Biblical passages to which the author referred? Oh, that's right, it's a rhetorical question: the answer is obviously NO. Actually, you are right in one respect: Jesus DID say that no one comes to the Father except through him, meaning Jesus. Contrary to the common argument, I was always taught to believe that this is a caution to humans who would judge their fellows: Jesus alone makes the decision, and you might be in for a big surprise, big fella, when YOU get to those Pearly Gates and face the judgment. Oh, and by the way, Jesus never said anyone is going to hell. He simply doesn't discuss it. If you accept the idea that Satan had the power the tempt Christ by offering him rule over all the earth if he would renounce God and worship him, then you must draw the conclusion that Satan is the ruler of the earth. Where, then is Hell, and who's in charge of it? I'll leave you to ponder that one.
Anyway, go back home and read the Golden Rule: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." I think that covers it, don't you?Uh, "wwagnac", did you READ the article to which you are responding? Have you bothered to reread the Biblical passages to which the author referred? Oh, that's right, it's a rhetorical question: the answer is obviously NO. Actually, you are right in one respect: Jesus DID say that no one comes to the Father except through him, meaning Jesus. Contrary to the common argument, I was always taught to believe that this is a caution to humans who would judge their fellows: Jesus alone makes the decision, and you might be in for a big surprise, big fella, when YOU get to those Pearly Gates and face the judgment. Oh, and by the way, Jesus never said anyone is going to hell. He simply doesn't discuss it. If you accept the idea that Satan had the power the tempt Christ by offering him rule over all the earth if he would renounce God and worship him, then you must draw the conclusion that Satan is the ruler of the earth. Where, then is Hell, and who's in charge of it? I'll leave you to ponder that one.
Anyway, go back home and read the Golden Rule: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." I think that covers it, don't you?
No where in the bible does it say that it is ok to molest your children, cheat on taxes, and hate everyone who is NOT you. But it is ok for the fundimental christians to do exacltly that. How many incest componds are there in this country? TONS! It seems like every week an evangelist gets busted by the IRS to tax fraud. And who can forget preachers and churches too, along with those christian aid groups. But that is OK! And last but not least, if you do NOT represnt the ideal, moraly sound, ultra-conservative, nazi-like beliefs....then you are worse than trash! Anyone who shows any ideal that is not found in a 2000 year old piece of fiction is spat upon, called a sinner, and moraly corupt, and are told the greatest catch all phrase that they are "GOING TO HELL!!!"
But hey, who am I to argue against all these evangalist that do years of research at their custom made schools so they can create their own ciriculm. Schools that teach them exacly how to spread hate and intolerance.
If their is truly a god...then please save me from these followers of yours!!!
If they read the Bible instead of exclusively reading their liberal peers' papers then they would understand what scholars of old knew...God hates homosexuality as much as any other sin. And that marriage between a man and a woman blessed by God has been shown to be the example that we should follow.