Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

kimberlyp — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:10:52 GMT

John McCain has not in my opinion communicated his economic positions well. Below is my attempt to clarify them.

McCain believes in Jeffersonian Democracy. What does that mean? Thomas Jefferson argued against Federalism, as he felt that it posed a risk and infringement to the liberty of Americans. The Federal government is a necessary evil, which should operate on the common benefit, security, and protection of Citizens, and should be watched closely and its powers should be minimized.

Science recently has determined that there is a scientific reason why this is the best possible configuration. Networks of all types, financial, government, electrical, communicative, all behave under certain laws. These laws have been described well in layman’s terms by Lazlo Barabasi in his book “Linked.” These laws argue against centralized networks as they are prone to cascade failures and that distributed adaptable networks are much more robust and capable of sustaining damage to one part of the network and reconfiguring themselves and continue to function. What this tells you is that democracy and capitalism, is inherently more stable than other types of systems of economic distribution and governance.

Capitalism has been moving towards big business, since the industrial revolution, and this has led to a centralization of Wealth which has placed our economy in the current economic crisis we face today. It is not accurate to place the blame on Wall Street, or on homeowners, for the current financial crisis. The crisis was driven by the centralized wealth and dynamics of the networked global economy.

The solution to the problem is to move toward decentralization of all critical networks such as Government and Financial.

McCain holds that we need to move from Big Business to many competing companies run on Main Street, and incentivize investment in small business over big business.

McCain also holds that regulation much like Big government needs to be circumscribed in its powers, but that it’s a necessary evil. The idea is that centralized standards, and regulation, reduce the cost of compliance and lead to greater efficiency.

McCain understands we need regulation and standards, but regulation and standards must be able to evolve and adapt, while cost of compliance must be the same for individuals as for big business on a basis that places the individual or small business with an equal footing to gig government or big business.

(In my opinion, this needs to be slanted towards small business and individuals. That it’s better to err on the side of smaller concerns.)

McCain is against Obama’s tax plan, because increasing capital gains tax on business, and investment, because it acts as a barrier to deploying monies to generate wealth formation. A simple way to understand this is as friction to the speed at which capital flows through the system. This matters to every American, not just the wealthy, as McCain critics say. This matters to every American because if assets are not deployed, and or leveraged, then entrepreneurial activities are curtailed, and with this comes a reduction in jobs, and a decrease in wealth distribution, and most importantly to wealth concentration which makes the average American a indentured servant to the concentrated wealth.

McCain understands that we need alter wealth distribution in this country such that it benefits the middle class and grows it. He also understands that in a free society you do not accomplish this by confiscating another’s wealth and redistribute it to others on the government’s whim. This was the approach of the old Soviet Union. What we need to do is provide incentives for people to place their wealth into the system so that others can become wealthy in their own right.

For those that think but I just want a job, and this does not matter to you, more business creation, leads to more jobs, and in today’s world with equity participation, greater wealth.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

boombox — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:16:01 GMT

Howard, you're not much of a journalist, either.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

michael Ber — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:17:13 GMT

Apparently you forgot that the Ali "rope a dope",was what made him the greatest fighter that ever was.

Making an Ali vs. Frasier analogy is very consistent with this race.

Using a relentless,pesky jab and keeping a cool head while wearing down his opponent,is exactly what Obama did last night!

This is a fifteen round fight just like Ali vs. Frasier.

Obama used the ropes last night,masterfully!

But lastly to compare McCain to the great Joe Frasier,is an insult.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sarahs121 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:21:32 GMT

I think I must have been watching a different debate than all the other people posting here. I thought McCain was the clear winner. I was actually kind of embarrased for Obama b/c he seemed to be spouting off lines he had memorized instead of actually responding to the questions. McCain came across as someone who just strolled in and answered the questions honestly from experience and knowledge, not as someone who had spent weeks rehearsing lines fed to him by an advisor. But more than anything what struck is that McCain came across as someone who knows how to get things done. Obama seemed like all my old college professors. They talk a great game but when it comes down to functioning in the real world outside of academia....they flounder. Several of my friends thought the same thing...and we are all college-educated Democrats who are supposed to lean towards Obama. When I read all the commentaries this morning grading the debates I felt like I was living in the Twilight Zone.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

akatz — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:27:40 GMT

Howard,

You are beginning to get it. Almost.

Many of us (myself included) are sick to death of testosterone-driven politics. All you pundits today can talk about is boxing and football metaphors. Didn't any of you ever grow up to be adults, to put the games away and really think about what's best for this country and the world? Howard, we know you're better than that.

Too many people have died for the metaphors, including 4,173 American soldiers in Iraq.

The worst is the talking heads on television, analyzing everything in terms of mortal combat, vying not for truth or history, but for more television-friendly conflict.

Last night I was so impressed with Barack Obama. Polite, gentlemanly but not weak. Very knowledgeable, especially considering his short time in the Senate. Thoughtful, careful, not threatening to send another 150,000 soldiers to their death at the drop of a hat.

He didn't need to anihilate McCain, just get more votes (which apparently he succeeded at). He refused to be unkind, dismissive or insulting. He was man enough (adult enough) to acknowledge when McCain was right, which ultimately costs him nothing, but promises a potentially great consensus government under Obama.

He promised a new kind of politics in the primaries, and last night he demonstrated it.

Why do you, and the other talking-class pundits always have to pose every challenge as two men pissing in their corners, or causing permanent damage to each other in the barbaric boxing arena? Why did Hillary even have to convince you that she had bigger testicles than any man in the race?

How about this, for a change: thoughfulness, kindness, respect, compassion? How about a better world, a better country, a nobler purpose?

Time for you and the rest of your brethren to get in touch with the people of the world - who mostly want peace, security and prosperity, not more battle, war, conflict and "winners and losers".

Just my $.02

A. A. Katz

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Just Say It — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:29:19 GMT

I totally agree with Sarah. McCain blew Obama away.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Walter28 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:30:36 GMT

I'm a (former) democrat that will be voting for McCain this year. Most of my friends feel the same way but will not admit to it because they Obama camp had the audacity to claim that any democrat that won't vote for him is an ignorant racist. Not true. The reason why I won't vote for him is simple and easy to understand. I'm a moderate and I'm not a blind faith follower of any party. In all honesty, I see Bush in Obama a lot more so than McCain. First of all, what was the Bush Doctrine? If you say it's "preemption", you're wrong. Truman (a democrat) preempted war against Korea and JFK (another democrat) preempted war against Vietnam long before Bush was even a blip on the national radar screen. However, no president in history has expanded the bureaucracy or tacked on more government spending than W. Bush has. So in actuality, the "Bush Doctrine" is one of rampant, unchecked, uncontrollable spending and an unmitigated, unassailable, over-expansion of the government. What is Obama proposing? More wild and grotesque spending and a general widening of the all-encompassing broken bureaucracy. Even if Obama is proposing to spend the money in different areas and expand the government for different reasons, the results are the same in the long run... our economy is left for dead and the government overreaches, gets involved in business that it shouldn't be and the red tape-mummification that ensues renders the entire bureaucracy completely ineffective and useless (see Katrina).

I find it amusing that people are so quick to forget. When Bush ran against Gore in 2000, tell me, which one had "experience" and which one was the naive newcomer to Washington that thought he could "transform" the place with his idealistic way of thinking? You're right if you said "Bush". Now in '08, which candidate is the unqualified, naive newcomer who thinks he can "transform" Washington because of his idealism? That's right, it's Obama. We learned from W. Bush himself that it's not always a good idea to boot the guy that actually knows what he's talking about and elect the naive, ideologue who's promising a new world order... Also, no one in the media is mentioning the fact that John McCain was John Kerry's first choice for VP in '04. Maybe the reason democrats are having such a tough time tying McCain to Bush is because they've spent the last 8 years promoting him as their greatest bipartisan ally...

Even those who possess primitive bundles of nerves in their heads (rather than modern human brains) can tell you Bush was possibly the worst president in the existence of the presidency. Of course, about half of those people couldn't tell you exactly what made him so bad (i.e. the ones who turned around and nominated Obama). The problem is this, the mistakes Bush made are not make believe, they are real, critical, prosperity-breaking blunders that aren't going to magically disappear. We can't pretend as if the Bush-era never happened (though that would be nice if we could). We must work to correct those problems or else they will become exponentially worse... and I'm not talking about the way "Europeans perceive us" or our "global image abroad"... that's the least of our worries (and is probably the only thing Obama can actually fix), I'm talking about fundamental problems that could destroy the American way of life as we know it; foreign policy/war and the economy. Obama is largely proposing that we ignore the problems that Bush created as if they never happened in the first place. He wants to withdrawal from Iraq which would essentially create an Iranian super-state and would only compound the problem. He wants to dismantle our nuclear arsenal at a time when we're entering economic downturn and our enemies are starting to acquire nuclear weapons... truly, a reckless, short-sighted, utopian idea if I've ever heard one. After the Bush regime, our nukes may be all that we have left. Speaking of nuclear powers, Obama is so naive he publicly proclaimed that he'd invade one of our supposed "allies" (Pakistan) while secret raids were already going on in that country. In WWII they always said "loose lips sink ships" well nowadays "loose lips blow up hotels". As for economic issues, Obama's "big business tax" is a joke. It may make for a good sound-bite and sound like a nice idea in theory but it doesn't work... big businesses are smarter than that. They simply pass off the tax onto the consumers by increasing the prices of their goods and services to make up the difference, which is the last thing we need while on the verge on the Great Depression Part Deux. Raising taxes on the financials would have been a good idea coming out of the Clinton-era... but not when our financial system is on the verge of total collapse.

Of course, if Obama had been around Washington a little longer and wasn't so green he'd probably catch on to these kinds of things. He's already starting to realize that his utopian ideas (that only represent a tiny sliver of the democratic party; those of the far left-wing activists) do not fly in middle-America. That's why he's had to try to shift so many of his policies to the center. But you see that's the problem... Obama is not the moderate (like Hilary) that he claims to be. He was nominated by the far left wing of the party and does not represent the views of the majority of his own party let alone the rest of the country. McCain may have his faults but at least he recognizes what needs to be done to get this country back on track. Now is not the time for more spending and idealism. Now is the time for a cold, hard dose of reality and some solutions.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

navi8001 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:31:02 GMT

I am not sure whether pundits actually believe the stuff they write themselves and or should stay away from analogies they know nothing about. Why would one go for a knockout punch in round 1 of a 3 round fight? Furthermore, any good boxer and Ali was the best of them wouldn't come out the gate swinging but rather soften his opponent up and most importantly in the early rounds project an air of confidence and stability. If Obama swung and missed it would have surely left him staggering into the other two debates. He did what he needed to do last night which was stand toe-to-toe with McCain and by all accounts he did that. Could he have swung more, thrown more jibes at McCain possibly, but that wouldn't have gained him anything. There is still 5 weeks to go in this contest. Perhaps Mr. Fineman forgets that Ali used to do the "rope-a-dope" which meant take the best that his opponent had to offer and when and only when the time was right deliver the knockout blow. Little food for thought for our boxing ethusiast.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Simpleton — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:31:04 GMT

sarahs121,

I can confirm that you must have been watching a different debate. You say that you are living in the Twilight Zone.

I concur with that as well, because the alternative is that you are delusional.

I am happy that you have friends in your hour of need...unless they are, er, only in the Twilight Zone you inhabit.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TheVigil — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:33:39 GMT

Does anyone else get the impression Mr. Fineman doesn't know much about boxing?

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sarahs121 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:38:43 GMT

Simpleton (very appropriate moniker btw),

I love your patronizing, condescending post in response to my thoughtful one. Those who have to attack other people's opinions instead of agreeing to disagree are clearly insecure. Haven't you learned yet that when you attack other's, you only push them further away from your viewpoint? Keep it up....you are pushing more votes toward McCain. I love it!!!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Walter93 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:50:10 GMT

Obama, "I agree with John," "I agree with John," " I agree with John."

Obama agreed with McCain 90% of the time.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

BoogieStik — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:56:13 GMT

"But here’s the question: Is a devastating puncher who we want in a president? Is that who we want in our next president?"

Precisely, Mr. Fineman. Which of these terms is more closely aligned with 'pit bull': statesman, or terrorist?

Over and over again McCain could only assert, but not demonstrate, that Obama lacks sufficient experience, as if his claiming it made it so. Today's post-debate poll numbers reflect the fact that most of the electorate is intelligent enough to see through McCain's use (and overuse) of this claim, which is little more than talking point spin.

Despite his objections that Obama didn't "understand", it was McCain who couldn't grasp Obama's positions well enough to be able to re-articulate them. How could anyone miss the irony of McCain criticizing Obama as "inflexible" after Obama dressed McCain and Bush down for their inflexible narrow focus on Iraq?

And as for his continued insistence on focusing on the surge as opposed to the entire war, how can this "foreign affairs expert" so completely fail to see the forest for the trees? Yes, it's a nice looking stand there, John...but you're missing the big picture. We're in the wrong forest.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

ob08 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:56:54 GMT

mr. Fineman, I don't know waht debate you were watching but I did not hear McSame utter one word about the middle class and breaks for the middle class. President Obama got all his taling points through while McSame was too busy talking about the past. Nobody cares what you say. What matters are what the people say and all the polls showed that President Obama connected with the American people. McSame came acros as arrogant - how dare did he not once acknoledge President Obama. McSame hasn't done *** about the veterans. How the hell is he going to take care of the veterans when he has voted against all veteran bills in cluding the latest GI bill. Mr. Fineman you suck and I hope Olberman don't invite your sorry "a" on his show.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Johnny1967 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:57:15 GMT

Granted, McCain has the heart. However, he no longer has the ability, energy, or strenght to follow his heart. The pressure from the powerhouse of the Republican Party is too much for the aging fighter. Consequently, his judgment is not reliable.

Interestingly, the same could be said about George W. Bush. Its not that President Bush is a bad person. Its just that he was pressured into making some very bad decisions by the powerful people surrounding him. Either those powerhouses just do not get it or are driven by self interest not consistent with sound governmental policies.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

SaveUs2008 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:58:37 GMT

Just because you licked Muhammad Ali's balls does not mean you know the man. In case you didn't know, I know Ali and Ali is for Obama. I also knew Edward R. Murrow, and Fineman: you are no Murrow.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

steveeyes — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:59:02 GMT

What McCain is not getting is that Americans, Main St, is more scared of losing their dreams, more concerned about our families, more afraid of not being able to meet our basic needs of health care, paying our bills, etc, than we are of the terrorists.

In other words, American people have a lower opinion of the people in power, corporate America who steals from the poor to give to the rich and politicians who ignores our needs than we are of the terrorists an ocean away.

At least we expect the terrorists to try to crush the American dream, but for our own representatives to do so is frightening.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

love234america — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:59:48 GMT

Don't believe for a second the polls the liberal media is stating. I expect most of the newspapers in major U.S. cities and the television media to say Obama won; they would not say in a million years that McCann won.....they would just keep polling and keep polling until they got the numbers where they wanted them, discarding the proMcCann votes. I now rarely read our city's newspaper, the 4th largest city in the U.S. Too liberal. We watched the debate on PBS and abandoned the after-debate lies. It is terrible that the United States media is so very controlled (just like Russia) and attempts to give their opinions as news, brainwashing the young. Most of us older folks have caught on and don't believe very much that is reported in politics. The media has ruined our free press; we have no choice except for a couple of cable news channels, so we are losing our democracy. The Socialist States of America, sound good to you? It's coming to that.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Anticrisis — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:00:17 GMT

Namedropper.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

saxxon_domela — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:00:36 GMT

I tend to agree with you that, watching the debate, McCain had a more combative style that I thought would "win" the debate for him. I was surprised when the instant polls showed him having "lost." Upon reflection and a closer examination of the polling, a couple of items became apparent. Men were split about 50/50 on who had won. I suspect this reflected who they favored prior to the debate starting. Men, it seems to me, tend to go for the testosterone factor. Women, by a rather large percentage, thought Obama had won. I suspect women were more focused on substance rather than style. If this is the case, it is a very big win for Obama. His campaign had only hoped to "hold serve" in this debate. If they have moved a number of undecided women into the Obama column, it would be beyond their wildest expectations.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Brain Washed — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:01:38 GMT

The debate was great! Both men promoted their ideas well!

But all of this won't matter once this news gets out. The FBI has already started an investigation on this. Check out this youtube clib:

Just copy this, paste it, and enter it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1BOj6kTPgE&feature=iv&annotation_id=event_352711

You'll see what I mean.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

BoogieStik — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:03:10 GMT

What's up with finding fault with Obama for acknowledging it when he agreed with McCain? Does McCain arrive at his positions merely by disagreeing with Obama's positions?

I have a neighbor with whom I agree on 95% of everything I discuss with him. But that doesn't mean I voted for him for president of our homeowners association. The key is, what are the 5% of the issues I disagree with him on, and how relevant are those issues?

To say a candidate has to disagree with everything his opponent says is moronic. And a candidate who takes such a position raises questions of trustworthiness.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Gerard Jones — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:03:30 GMT

"You either don’t know how to or can’t be a closer." Odd, then, that Obama is the nominee and Hillary Clinton's out stumping for him. Sure looks like SOMETHING got closed. I suspect we'll be seeing some pretty definitive "closing" on Nov. 4, too.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

dragonfly777 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:04:05 GMT

I believe Cassius Clay was a Muslim. These are Obama's own words and I have a real problem with these statements!

From Dreams of My Father: 'I ceased to advertise my mother's race at the age of 12 or 13, when I began to suspect that by doing so I was ingratiating myself to whites.'

From Dreams of My Father : 'I found a solace in

nursing a pervasive sense of grievance and animosity against my mother's race.'

From Dreams of My Father: 'There was something

about him that made me wary, a little too sure of himself, maybe. And white.'

From Dreams of My Father: 'It remained necessary

to prove which side you were on, to show your loyalty to the black masses, to strike out and name names.'

From Dreams of My Father: 'I never emulate white

men and brown men whose fates didn't speak to my own. It was into my father's image, the black man, son of Africa ,( he lies here he has no African root he is Arab! ) that I'd packed all the attributes I sought in myself , the attributes of Martin and Malcolm, Du Bois and Mandela.'

This is the change Obama plans!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Ike The Independent — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:05:14 GMT

Who is?

Who out there has the style of Ali in politics?

Sen. Obama doesn't have to be Ali to be a great President, he just has to be the opposite of Bush!

We need a thinking man in the White House. A man that will make the right decision, not the one who can provide a knock punch in a debate.

Wake up, America!

Ike, the independent

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

donputnam — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:06:08 GMT

As expected, both sides claim victory. McCain came across as the alpha-dog, but Obama did well – primarily because of his oratory skills. The guy sure can talk. And that’s scary considering who he really is and what he and his radical friends have planned for America.

Fortunately, the story of Obama’s long-standing radicalism and his ties to agitating, rabble-rousing, welfare promoting groups like ACORN; and terrorists like Bill Ayers and Bernadine Dorhn, will be exposed now that the story has FINALLY been picked up by such mainstream media as the Wall Street Journal (see Stanley Kurtz’ article: Obama and Ayers Pushed Radicalism On Schools, Sept 23).

And, despite the Obama camp’s attempts to cover it up, evidence has surfaced that proves he lied when he told us Ayers was “just a guy in my neighborhood”. After all, Obama’s political career was launched in Ayers’ LIVINGROOM for crying out loud! See Kurtz’ other articles at the ‘Ethics and Public Policy Center’ regarding Obama’s shameful relationships with the radical left. Also see Steve Diamond’s blog at ‘Global Labor and Politics’.

Bye Bye Bama.

Don Putnam

Austin, TX

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sarahs121 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:06:53 GMT

I went to CNN and read their article about the debate poll results. Sure enough people who are saying the results were skewed in favor of Obama are right. This is an excerpt: "The results may be favoring Obama simply because more Democrats than Republicans tuned in to the debate. Of the debate-watchers questioned in this poll, 41 percent of the respondents identified themselves as Democrats, 27 percent as Republicans and 30 percent as independents." Ya think???

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sarahs121 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:08:39 GMT

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

dragonfly777 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:08:40 GMT

I hope Obama's stuttering and high Rhetoric will impress the Russians. They don't give a crap about Obama's Hravard education or his high mindness. If Obama gets into office Russia will invade all of Georgia, Ossentia and the surrounding areas. Obama will freeze and it will be a damn mess! While he runs somerhetoric garbage on the American people. North Krea and Iran will take advantage of stupid junior.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

ukeman — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:08:59 GMT

I think this is a great article on the debate; the best so far! Great counter-point, if that is what you call it by dancing between metaphors, ups and downs.

As an Obama supporter I don't think you were beiing partisan for or against my choice.

Which allows me to be honest about McCains strengths evident in the debate; he was strong and he had a lot of info and he was tactically on point; not sure if it was the right tactic (on the offense), but he kept to it.

I think it was his best showing, but we all seem to know that unless you are a dyed in the wool republican, or a bigot of any sort, his age and his message; more of the same, are not what are in the best interests of this country.

I think we all have to face it; whatever your stripe, Bush has had 8 years; are you better off? No.

Thank you for being honest and witty.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Walter28 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:16:23 GMT

I'm a (former) democrat that will be voting for McCain this year. Most of my friends feel the same way but will not admit to it because the Obama camp had the audacity to claim that any democrat that won't vote for him is an ignorant racist. Not true. The reason why I won't vote for him is simple and easy to understand. I'm a moderate and I'm not a blind faith follower of any party. In all honesty, I see Bush in Obama a lot more so than McCain. First of all, what was the Bush Doctrine? If you say it's "preemption", you're wrong. Truman (a democrat) preempted war against Korea and JFK (another democrat) preempted war against Vietnam long before Bush was even a blip on the national radar screen. However, no president in history has expanded the bureaucracy or tacked on more government spending than W. Bush has. So in actuality, the "Bush Doctrine" is one of rampant, unchecked, uncontrollable spending and an unmitigated, unassailable, over-expansion of the government. What is Obama proposing? More wild and grotesque spending and a general widening of the all-encompassing broken bureaucracy. Even if Obama is proposing to spend the money in different areas and expand the government for different reasons, the results are the same in the long run... our economy is left for dead and the government overreaches, gets involved in business that it shouldn't be and the red tape-mummification that ensues renders the entire bureaucracy completely ineffective and useless (see Katrina).

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

thehappyamerican — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:16:44 GMT

Obama did not debate away from his associates and people who wanted the violence going around the world to come to the American streets!

Obama does not mean peace. Nor stand for it!

For such groups as the weather underground to flourish the must be a certain amount of violence somewhere for political manipulation! To advance an agenda of gun control there must be a certain amount of violence on our streets!

Acorn and Obama my oppose a well known war but they do not want peace! Bill Ayers is a terrorist. Acorn an agenda!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Vet4Obama — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:35:52 GMT

OBAMA GETS KO'd by VIETNAM WAR HERO ...oh, that's next week’s line.

Fineman, what fight did you watch last night? With the media, Obama is elite, uppity, arrogant, distant, or professorial. And now he can’t close a fight. How did he get this far? I know he doesn't write columns or serve as a political pundit - but he life's work is honorable in my opinion.

Your eyes have failed you once again. Yosemite Sam, err...John McCain's face looked as if he were going blow a gasket every time Obama counter punched him in face with the series of errors he has made in some 26 years. Yes, he did find time to agree with McCain and looked him squarely in the eye when the opportunity presented itself. All the while McCain sneered and tightly clinched his jaws all night in while citing all the places visited the troops.

I guess if that accounts for foreign policy chops - you're right, McCain closed the deal.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sarahs121 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:47:35 GMT

Just thought I would share info I found at ABC news. Jake Taper is a blogger for ABC and he posted this yesterday. Anybody else think it is suspicious that Obama texted his supporters to watch the debate on CNN and then their poll was skewed so much in favor of Obama? It was actually pretty funny b/c it made fun of MSNBC being so in the tank for Obama - -

Two Years of Re-Branding and This Is the Thanks MSNBC Gets? "September 26, 2008 6:31 PM. As my colleague Rick Klein was first to point out, the Obama campaign sent out a text message this afternoon, reading:"Watch Barack debate John McCain tonight at 9 pm Eastern on CNN. Also, remind friends to register to vote at VoteForChange.com. Please forward this message."CNN? It will air everywhere! What's the deal?And why the free promo for CNN?Fox News, I'm sure, has some ideas...Just now, I got a new text: "Watch Barack debate John McCain tonight at 9 pm ET on any of the major networks or cable. Fwd this msg & remind friends to register to vote at VoteForChange.com. In other words: Oops! JPT" -- Obama only corrected his text to say it was on every network AFTER Jake Tapper posted the blog with the original text message.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

MichaelDSellers — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:10:36 GMT

Obama had a much clearer idea of what he had to do than the pundits. He knew his target audience were millions of undecided voters who would be truly taking his measure for the first time. He had to appear presidential and in command of the material and he did. He had to be the least angry black man any of these people had ever seen. He had to be true to his promise of a new style of politics in Washington and he did precisely that, crediting McCain for being right about some things, wrong about others. (That played extremely well on the dial-o-meter's; by contrast, every time McCain acted contemptuous of Obama the lines went down. People are tired of this.) Mission accomplished for Obama.

McCain, on the other hand, had to find a way to hit it out of the park because of his recent blunders and he didn't get it done. Moreover his contemptuous, troll-like presentation didn't play well with the audience he needed to win over. His "Obama just doesn't get it" moments seemed divorced from reality in that he seemed to repeat that line randomly, not in response to any actual thing that Obama said but rather as a mantra.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

pinkpanther87413 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:14:14 GMT

MCCAIN BIT HIS EAR!! FIGHT OVER! MCCAIN HIT BELOW THE BELT, OBAMA DEFENDED VERY VERY WELL,MMM I WOUNDER HOW DID THEY FIT ALL THOSE WRINKELS ON MCCAIN BEHIND THE POTIUM,THAT AND HE NEVER SHOWED HIS RIGHT EAR WHERE THE RECIEVER WAS, FOR WORDS FROM THE BACK???

MCCAIN YOU VOTED TO REMOVE ME FROM WORKING DUE TO MY AGE OF 65. I'M NOT CAPABLE OF RUNNING A GAS STATION.

SO AT 72 YOU CAN?????

I DOUBT IT SERIOUSLY, AND QUAYLE OH YA PALIN, IS IN NO WAY CAPABLE OF RUNNING A LEMON AID STAND!

HARLEYISHERE

DITTO!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Perusing-through — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:15:15 GMT

In response to Andrew Romano’s article calling Mississippi debate win for McCain.

Reference: http://blog.newsweek.com/blogs/stumper/archive/2008/09/26/mccain-won-but-will-it-matter/comments.aspx

= = = = =

TO: ANDREW ROMANO (Newsweek Journalist),

Young man, , , you crack me up.

I have read a number of your articles and although you are a decent writer, your youth and shortsightedness continue to handicap your potential for being the next Tim Russert. I keep telling you Andrew that "wise and discerning" readers digest the thoughts you put into words and it is "blatantly obvious" that you are having a tough time objectively analyzing GOP stump speech (aka kool-aid) meant only to win an election, verses the "brutal reality" of John McCain & Sarah Palin character and judgment.

Andrew, why can't you see that we the readers are on to you? You are a Barry Goldwater boy faking as an "Independent". You are a smaller version of Lou Dobbs, in that you want the public to believe you have no dog in this race. But like Dobbs you have a clear pick in this race and both of you have already chosen McCain - - no matter what. So please drop all the fancy words and pick up your "Sean Hannity, Bill O'Reilly" pen & paper, and redo this article the way you really feel.

Now regarding the winner of last nights debate, as a true "Independent and thoughtful" citizen-voter, it is clear to me that Obama won this debate. To use a baseball analogy, Obama did leave a lot of men on base. There were several doors McCain left wide open that Obama did not use to his advantage for the easy score. But Obama scored enough points with his "complete package" to outlast McCain.

For me, Obama's confidence and steely fortitude allowed him to stand toe-to-toe with a Senate giant like John McCain and successfully challenge McCain on his 26-years of "foreign-policy expertise". But Obama did not allow McCain to escape his "incorrect" judgment for voting to start a war with Iraq. Obama also reminded the audiences that it was McCain's deregulation philosophy that help shuttle in today’s Wall Street disaster.

And while Obama was showing McCain respect by acknowledging him through name and especially by eye contact, McCain displayed "utter disrespect and contempt" for Obama by: (1.) NOT acknowledging Obama by name; (2.) NOT facing and making eye contact with Obama; (3.) NOT acknowledging when Obama was "correct" or "right" in many solutions they both agreed.

McCain's contempt and lack of respect for Obama, who has much in common with McCain including the fact that they are both public servants and Christian brothers, makes it extremely difficult to see McCain as an intelligent negotiator in middle-east policies where there are times when McCain will need to go eye-to-eye with those he may detest. How can McCain negotiate with those he vehemently disagrees, when he cannot speak face-to-face with his own Christian-American brother (Obama) standing just 5-yards away? McCain was clearly filled with rage and was doing all he could to contain himself.

McCAIN's TEMPERAMENT AND APPARENT DISCUSS FOR OBAMA CAUSED HIM TO LOSE THE DEBATE. McCAIN ONCE AGAIN PROVED IN FRONT OF MILLIONS OF VIEWERS THAT HE IS A HOT-HEAD EASILY DISTURBED AND EASILY MOVED TO INSTABILITIES. McCAIN CANNOT BE TRUSTED WITH THE NATION's INTEREST IN HAND. AND THIS MR. ANDREW ROMANO IS WHERE YOUR YOUTHFUL SHORTSIGHTEDNESS AND LACK OF DISCERNMENT CAUSED YOU TO MISS AN IMPORTANT FACTOR IN DETERMINING THE OBVIOUS WINNER OF THE DEBATE IN MISSISSIPPI.

GOD Bless America!

GOD Bless the Obama-Biden Leadership!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

dem321 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:15:48 GMT

Senator,

Get mad for once! During the debates last night (9/26/08) you had ample opportunities to derail Senator McCain and you simple didn't! You should have hammered him on his connection to the Bush White House on the economy, you didn't. You should have stuck to his record on the ill-started and ill-fated Iraq war, you didn't. You let him go on and on about nonsense, even as the moderator allowed McCain to spew untruths about everything from the surge to what little was spoken on the economy. Senator Obama, I have donated to your campaign and I believe that you should have the opportunity to turn this country around, however to keep me from changing my mind and staying home on election day, you MUST GET TOUGH! Enough with the congeniality of telling Senator McCain he's right and you agree with him. Unless you truly do agree with his flawed policies, STOP IT! Show me how you're different, stronger and able to connect with what's important to me as a middle-class American. If I don't see a change in the next 2 debates, Senator, you've lost my vote and that would be very sad indeed!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

interestedCanuck — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:18:35 GMT

Obama is too much of a gentleman . He knew he did not need a knock out punch to ground McCain. Therefore he treated him with respect and did not do any bone crunching. He didn't need to . However, I warn McCain that as the election gets closer and more negative attack ads come from the Republican campaign, I would not count on Mr. Obama being so kind to the old man .

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

mart7lin — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:22:19 GMT

WHATEVER!!!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

mart7lin — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:24:17 GMT

McCain looked like a grumpy old man for much of the debate. He really worked at not blowing his top the whole time.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Vet4Obama — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:26:33 GMT

HarleyisHere - it appears you didn't read my statement in it's entirity or my attempt at satire failed resonate with you. I also witnessed McCain - just saying what ever TALKING POINTs (11 to be exact) came to his demented old mind. I also LMAO when I read your response.

More importantly, and once again...Yosemite Sam, err...John McCain's face looked as if he were going blow a gasket every time Obama counter punched him in face with the series of errors he has made over the 26 years. Yes, he did find time to agree with McCain and looked him squarely in the eye when the opportunity presented itself. All the while McCain sneered and tightly clinched his jaws while citing all the places visited the troops.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sarahs121 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:28:07 GMT

Perusing-through- Why do you Obama supporters get so mad at legitimate differences of opinion? I think McCain mopped the floor with Obama. I was leaning toward McCain already but last night sealed the deal for me. I pick the older, experienced man who has a recored of achievement to point to over a young, naive, untested, man any day. I know approx half the population feels the same way. No need to get so angry b/c others disagree and feel that McCain won the debate. Also, you said McCain disrespected Obama??? I thought Obama was very disrespectful. He constantly interrupted McCain when it was McCain's turn to talk. McCain never did that to Obama. Plus. Obama repeatedly called McCain by his first name (and sometimes the wrong one) when in the history of presidential debates no other candidates has used first names. McCain was respectful by giving Obama the appropriate title "Senator" but Obama refused to do the same. Obama apparently was never taught manners.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

interestedCanuck — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:28:24 GMT

Mr. Fineman . I believe you will find that those were just the early rounds in the debate battle.

Obama is no fool. He is not prepared to deliver a knock out blow this early in the campaign.

I truly feel that the media ( yes, even the liberal loving ones ) have underestimated the force with which they are dealing . Mr Obama is focussed on winning and that is just what he is going to do . Ask Hillary how it feels to be hit by a train ! That train is on its way to the White House. Make no mistake about it .

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

tinkeraw — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:29:44 GMT

Instead of asking why didn't Obama give a knock out performance the better question is why didn't McCain after all he is the foreign policy expert. I am so sick and tired of the media asking why isn't Obama further ahead, why isn't Obama giving knock out punches, why isn't Obama sealing the deal. Well, hello, why isn't McCain?

The media needs to start playing fair and stop giving McCain a pass.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

indthinker — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:29:49 GMT

re.Harley is here- we're very pleased that you "use to be a democrat"..Your long winded comment

and your obvious inability to review the past eight years suggests that you may have just landed here on planet earth. As an indy I for one am pleased you chose to defect from your party..because on Nov 4, the group you have joined will be a small support group discussing how things went wrong for your NEW party. All you have to do is go back eight years...start from the beginning..and work your way up to yesterday, and there , you will find the answer

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

pinkpanther87413 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:34:57 GMT

LAST NIGHT I LISTENED TO MCCAIN SAY I,I,I,I, NO COMMENTS AS TO HIS CABNIT JUST I,I,I, IF HE KNOWS, WHY WOULD HE LISTEN?

LAST NIGHT I LISTENED TO A YOUNG MAN SAY WE,WE,WE,WE, TAKING INTO CONCIDERATION OF HIS CABNIT AND THE PEOPLE IE:NOT SET IN HIS WAYS,LIKE THE OTHER GUY,WHO "STAYS THE COURCE" TO WIN A WAR ON AN ADJECTIVE!

TIMOTHY MCVEIGH WAS AN AMERICAN.. SO IF THERE ARE MORE LIKE HIM, HOW CAN WE WIN THE WAR??? OBL LIVES CAUSE OF POLITICIANS LIKE MCCAIN,NOT OBAMA!

MICHAELDSELLERS

DITTO TIMES TWO!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

benluclar — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:36:10 GMT

Obama made a fool of himself. I was so tired of the ums and wait a minutes

and the wrong names of McCain. Sickening. This is Presidential material?

Oh brother!

McCain showed restraint that I in my chair could not, just listening to this

muttering on and on about nothing by Obama.

McCain is true class and shows the good judgment to be President.

Obama is a man trying to get a job to say "this is cool" when he sits down

in the Oval Office. Um, Um, Um, those were HIS words in an interview,

not mine. "this is cool" he said would be his first reaction if elected.

Ok. Real classy ...

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

indthinker — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:36:32 GMT

Posted by indthinker-correction- heyHarley is here...my bad ..my comment was directed at WALTER28..not you ..sorry.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

centrist1 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:36:45 GMT

It is time, finally, that we arrive at place where honest differences can be debated without always seeking the "knock-out" punch. The time has arrived when one person can say to an opponent "yes, on this we agree" without being thought to have given anything away. I have grown SO very tired of the CONSTANT air of confrontation we see at every turn. Thank goodness we have arrived at a place where one candidate for President doesn’t require the old tools of bluster and bullying. By far I prefer, and am bolstered by, the candidate capable of articulating fact, communicating the differences in policy and vision, and is able to stand firm on his/her own principals. Mr. Obama did that in spades last night and it is my hope he does NOT change his style to accommodate the pundits.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

interestedCanuck — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:38:06 GMT

to the blogger who was offended by Obama's use of McCain's first name.

Would you have been happier if he had just referred to him as " hey stupid " ?

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sedonakaren — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:38:18 GMT

Mr.Fineman,

Don't you get it yet? For nearly TWO year now, Obama has been telling this nation that he wants to "change Washington." And everyone replies, "What KIND of change are you talking about, Senator? Not only has he TOLD you details of his plan that includes getting rid of special interests and lobbyists, dealing with our enemies as well as our allies, etc, he is also SHOWING you.

One way he has already shown how different a candidate he is, is by awakening the youth of this country and getting them involved. Another way he has shown how different he is, is by the way in which he is running his campaign. Have you noticed his head honcho isn't out there attacking the other candidate like Howard Wolfson and Rick Davis have done. Sometimes Senator Obama even gets criticized for disappointing the public because he doesn't seem "tough enough."

Since when do we judge toughness of a man on how nasty and insulting he can be? If we did judge that way, McCain would certainly win this election hands down, and he'd be running against Hillary, not Obama.

We need to learn that the OLD WAY of running elections is not THE ONLY WAY. I have to laugh sometimes when I see Pat Buchanan rail against Obama because he doesn't attack enough. He smirks and giggles at nasty ads by Obama's opponents, wishing out loud that Obama would respond in kind and he'd get to watch a real "street fight." People like Buchanan think that's the way it is and should still be done.

I would like to remind everyone of the reason we're going through this painful process of electing a president. It is NOT for the "Entertainment" or "Excitement" of people like Pat Buchanan.We want to get it right this time. The only way we can do that is to stop talking about personalities , guilt by association, and "goccha's" and start finding out the vision these candidates have for this country. If we had done that in 2000 and 2004, Bush would have never been elected. Do not make the same mistake again! NOT THIS TIME!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

interestedCanuck — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:39:35 GMT

Bravo centrist !

I couldn't agree more !

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

aguasticas — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:40:30 GMT

And Pundit Fineman, you're no Edward R. Murrow either. But maybe we don't need Ed anymore. Maybe snappy verse is all that matters. Ali, on whom I lost 20 bucks in the Frazier fight in 1971 was certainly showing his stuff in the Liston photo. But if you recall, as an older, wiser boxer he made famous rope-a-dope, the laying back and letting your opponent wear himself out. There are three facets to Obama which make your pugilistic metaphor inapposite as well as the surfer one. First, the desire for utter victory never happens in these debates. The worst that happens is a gaffe like Ford made in '76 or a brusque put-down by Bentsen of Quayle in '88. But that may have an asterick by it when Palen debates Biden next week. If ever a potential slaughter would occur, this is the one possibility. Secondly, Obama is a nice guy. He is a smart guy. He is a deferential guy, especially to people older than he, raised as he was by his grandparents mostly. He is not going to destroy somebody just to win. It ain't his style. It ain't necessary. He gives people more credit than that. Of course he may be wrong on that score, but I don't think so this time out. Thirdly, he made his points. If it was a fight, he won on points. Obama's sport is basketball. It is misdirection, quick passes, rapid drives to the hoop. He parried, twisted, and rejected McCain's attacks. Again, he won on points by deferring the slam dunk except on Iraq, respecting his adversary, and making his case. You can use sports metaphors all you want, but what Obama showd was gravitas, intelligence, perspicacity. And that is what the 51% who say he "won" saw. Is there any doubt in anybody's mind, friend or foe of Obama, that McCain's judgment in picking a woefully inadequate running mate put not country first, but his election? I think not. Case closed. Take the photo. Obama by a nose.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

A Believer — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:40:36 GMT

I cannot imagine anyone thinking that debate was won by Obama. He can't even pronounce the names of the leaders in other countries, much less know who they are. This is who you want to put in charge of the White House? God help us all if Obama wins this election. I wasn't surprised when they said that 57% of Miss. thought Obama won the debate. My gosh, 75% of Miss. is black. I'm surprised it was not more. No way does any of the polls tell the true story. It could be a dead heat but other than that, the McCain voters will be out in record numbers come Nov. The snake oil that CNN is selling will soon be a bitter pill. They picked Bush 8 and 4 years ago and I voted against him and new he would be the worst Pres. we ever had, but CNN just had to help him get elected. Now, they want Obama and I'm not voting for him either. I think they want the worst so they can sell the news.

It's funny that the dems told Obama to stay and campaign and they would take care of the bail out bill problem. He made up a story that tried to sound like he was taking care of that and campainging also. Baa Hum Bug. The Pubs called for McCain to come and help keep this bill from passing. They needed him in Washington, but Not Obama. Had it not been for McCain, Obama would not have even gone to Washington. I'm guessing from that, that Obama is going to be the parties YES man. They will do the telling of what he is to do and not to do. If Obama wins it will be another one term dem. Clinton was the only dem in a very long time to win 2 terms but the dems did not like it that he was his own man. Well, they have found themselves a puppet. Poor Obama, finally making it to the finals and will never be a real winner. If you sell your soul to the devil you will have to pay a hugh price in the end. The dems will control his every move. Like Hillary when Bill went into office, they will tell Michelle to SIT DOWN and SHUT UP.

Well, You asked for it Toyota. Let the games begin. This country is in for the ride of its life.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

bill4truth — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:43:01 GMT

Howard, your question is premature: Foreign policy was supposed to be McCain's strong suite. He's got 26 years experience and 35 years with Mr. Henry Kissinger, and sounded knowledgeable enough on Georgia. Plus, he's a cantakersous, angry, lout. Why wasn't he able to knock out Obama in what was to be his best chance? To follow your Ali metaphor, Obama gave him the Ali "ropa dopa" - deflected all McCain's hits and completely underminded McCain's argument that he was too naive and inexperienced.

It was Obama who came to the debate with specifics to back up his points. It was McCain who - again - sounded like he had nothing to say for himself, only criticisms for his opponent. It was Obama who came off as the bigger man - secure enough to compliment McCain and to address him head on when he criticized him. McCain never did that even once.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

A Believer — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:43:30 GMT

Chucknuts,

That would have been fine and then McCain could have called him dumb $hit.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

madcasey — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:48:50 GMT

The only passion in the debate came when McCain was complaining about Obama's record. Neither candidate conveyed a sense of passion for the presidency. What Fineman is trying to avoid is, voters are, in fact, sick of partisanship. And partisanship is what McCain gave them in spades. Constant attacks on Obama, constant idealogical points about tax rates, "wasteful" spending, defense contracts -- he was preaching to Ronald Reagan's choir, and people aren't in the mood to hear it when we're seeing the effects of ten years of Reaganomic failure.

Fineman wants soundbytes. That's why McCain got him excited. The voters want positivity. That's why they scored this one for Obama.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

SteveKelson — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:51:56 GMT

Consider the fact that Ali also used the Rope-a-dope Friday night; no pun intended.

(I sure wanted to use it though)

He's given McCain enough rope on the campaign trail to allow the Senator to hang himself with lies befitting a horse thief. Let McCain spew forth his 15 well rehearsed talking points to let America see the McCain circus as no more than a two trick pony act...i.e., POW and surge.

The self professed 'Maverick' will throw these continued weak punches, during upcoming campaign appearances that resemble a weak, seriously fading Frank Sinatre karoake act. Obama is letting him wear himself out on a public with a renewed sense of hightened scrutiny needed for a Commander in Chief who doesn't botch Ike's final preparation for DDay. A true military man would know that story without fail. McCain even got that part wrong; a real disgrace to anyone who knows their history.

The new Great Communicator, will knock McCain clean out of the ring, during the final few upcoming rounds.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

dermr — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:52:13 GMT

Obama showed he is not presidential. When he was asked about serious financial crisis, he started this McCain-Bush punch. That's low. He keeps talking about all the good things he is going to do. With 700b bailout, he can do none and he has no clue about it (neither does McCain).

"I HAVE A BRACELET, TOO." by Obama is the "punch line" the whole night. He is just a little copy-cat. He can only either agree with McCain 100% or copy his idea. That's not a promising president.

Go Hillary and Palin.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

thocoe — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:53:21 GMT

Give me a break, Howard!!! This was round one. Maybe you're confused; Ali never knocked anybody out in the first round. You must be thinking of Mike Tyson. Two rounds to go yet; watch Obama, as in the words of Drew Bundini Brown, RUMBLE YOUNG MAN, RUMBLE.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

alicat — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:55:00 GMT

McCain scares a lot of people... with or without eye contact. Let's clean up our own backyeards before we clean up other countries. I understand McCain just thinks of war, but how about the stock market? Oh, by the way.

He's an insult to most persons intelligence but he's serious. That's a nightmare!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

7dollars — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:55:08 GMT

republicans are hoping to put john mc corpse and sarah (airhead) palin in the white house.

nice to see nothing's changed in the repubican party.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

mamafine — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:56:32 GMT

Mr. Fineman -- I think you hit the nail on the head. We Americans (at least, the ones like me) ARE tired of the fighting, tired of the badgering, tired of the swaggering. It is those very qualities displayed at the helm of our nation that have brought our reputation so low. Bill Clinton was a tough campaigner, but if you look at his demeanor in public, he has always been publicly respectful of those who opposed him. Hillary has a little nastier disposition than Bill, and Ithink that may be one reason she wasn't nominated. Not because she can be a nasty woman, just that she can be so nasty, period. And, by the way, think of how respectful Gore has been since 2000 -- if there's anyone who deserves to get nasty, he's your man.

The Bush worldview, and the McCain worldview, is that the best thing we can be is good fighters. McCain has said serving in the military is the highest calling to which one can aspire. REALLY? How about a teacher? How about a parent? That is the worldview that NEEDS CHANGE. That fighting is somehow admirable behavior. Obama's bent toward civility and diplomacy is the worldview that says we are ALL - from every country and every culture - we are ALL in this together. Boy, do we need that now! Does that mean he won't be tough when it's time to be genuinely tough? I don't think so. At all. But snarling at a debate is a waste of energy, not to mention good will. I, for one, wanted to hear discussion of issues, not one-upsmanship. Which one put country before personal advancement last night?

By the way, what's the deal with the snarky comment, "You're no Ali"? Why does having a photo of a hero on the wall mean Obama's trying to be Ali? Perhaps it's there for inspiration. Perhaps it's there for courage. Maybe our journalists would do well to get over the "fighting" mentality, too?

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

yyba1 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:56:50 GMT

Greetings:

John Mc Cain has the Ali punch and much more, now that Sarah Palin is with him, and he advocates the development of the NEW economic paradigm the "Integration of Labor(sm)" as the macro strategic way forward, that is the ONLY macro economic SOLUTION for the US economy...

With Wall Street and Washington playing "chicken," Washington "blinked" first, when it should have refused the "bailout," while it could not bear the pressure of the well choreograohed and scripted supporting role the DIJA played, if fact very well as it supporting role; with its timely big downers, as the fat lady sang, it's the end of the world.

I predict the "bailout" Washington actually writes, supposedly for Wall Street, will turn out to "bailouut Washington," much more than Wall Street; as this is to cover up as much of its "complicity " and tracks, as is possible. What's to be expected is, the next lines of people walking out of their offices, carrying their personal belongings, in a box, will be in the Washington Beltway Area, as John McCain/Sarah Palin calls America's closet socialists bluff(s) in Washington; that massively and boldly populate the 2.2 million federal employees within the reach of the Washington Beltway, and this will be even less of a loss to the country, than the hundreds of thousands who "hit the bricks," on Wall Street, in the last year.

OK, what's next? I thought you would never ask. The answer, the socialist media is as well avoiding, namely the NEW economic paradigm, the "Integration of Labor(sm)," as it will lead the US economy from 14 trillion to 45/50 trillion in GDP, based on its NEW model becoming the basis of a NEW US world class Global Technologic Infrastructure-GTI, that retools, retrains and reeducates the entrie US workforce, bringing its significant blessings and benefits, as tens of millions of good paying sustainable jobs, with its "Virginia Model" logic(s) to all the states of the USA.

I'm voting for McCain/Palin, as this is their strategic surprise for America and all Americans, and the socialists in the government and media, will just have to find other US patriots to attack and malign, as this is John's "knock out punch." And John will know when to use it to its required effect.

Shalom, Yehoshua Ya'acov

US Citizen Living Abroad in Jerusalem

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

underdog — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:58:46 GMT

Didn't watch the pregame discussion with the politcal pundits, turned away from CNN with their annoying graph during the game, and turned to a movie after the debate. Don't care what the pundits opinions are. Don't care for one candidate telling the voting record of the other candidate.

Not looking for a "knock out punch". Would prefer an honest decussion which is straight forward" here is my plan and here is my opinion of what it will do"., and at least let one of the candidates be honest and admit that the Wall Street bailout will kill any and all tax cuts. When they say they will cut taxes , now it goes into the "lie" column. We will be lucky if taxes are not raised. Btw, I have a small business, if I work hard, meaning 70 + hours a week, and I break 4250K + next year, why should I have to pay more taxes for my hard work?

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

DogBitez — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:59:56 GMT

I guess if you're into that old leprechaun style... nasty, sneering, smirking, with shaky voice... then you were wowed by McCain. He was so busy protecting his pot of gold, and his Wall Street friends' gold, he forgot to talk about US.

Personally, I was admiring the candidate that actually spoke intelligently... looked at his opponent, the audience, and the camera... and was able to state his case without having to resort to a junior high school level of aggression. I also identified with the candidate that, hey... what a thought... seemed to identify with me!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

pinkpanther87413 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:00:02 GMT

I HERD MCCAIN REFUSE TO TALK, SO FOR HIM WAR FIRST,, TALK SECOND,WRONG IN TODAYS WORLD BUT A OLD SEDIMENT OF THE OLD GOP POWERS, THAT PULL PUPPET STRINGS.

OBAMA PUNCHED UP HIGH ON THE BELT LINE!! MCCAINS WERE ALL BELOW THE BELT.

OBAMA WANTS TO TALK.. NOT GET US KILLED FOR SOMEONE ELESE PROBLEMS, LIKE PALIN AND MCCAIN!! .A WORLD WITHOUT WAR IS A NICE FURTURE TO SEE,,,NUCLEAR OBLIVION IS NOT!

107 TRILLION IN DEBT.. HAS ANYONE INSIDE THE USA SEEN IT YET? I BET DUBUI INDIA SHOWS A FEW HUNDERD TRILLION DOLLAR SURPLUS ECONOMY.AS DOES IRAQ

OBAMA AMERICA FIRST

MCCAIN,PAWN AMERICA FOR ASSETES, JUST ON LOANS!!!TRIPLE THE DEFICIT!!! WELL LEAVE IT FOR THE NEXT GUY, RIGHT???

SORRY FOR ALL CAPS, YA MY KEYBOARD IS NOT APPLYING IT'S SELF, SORRY ALL.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

BillyP — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:01:45 GMT

At the debate on Friday night John McCain seemed like a frustrated old man with a short fuse who insisted Barack Obama is not ready to lead. Well with Sarah Palin thinking she has foreign policy experience because she is Governor of a state that borders Russia, I am afraid too many GOP diehards have their heads in the sand if they think a McCain/Palin ticket is the best thing for the country.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Greg285 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:03:18 GMT

Howard, a win is a win, in case you didn't know that? Obama is a counter puncher and not a knockout artist, if you haven't realized that! He will delivered the knockout blow at the appropriate time and then what will you have to complain about? It seems that you people in the media always have nothing positive to say about Obama, no matter what he does? And McCain can just about get away with one gaffe after the next...

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Dragonqueen — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:07:14 GMT

Hey, Howard. I agree with you that Obama didn't crush McCain on Friday night. But, as you pointed out, that's not Obama's style. I totally agree with the nuanced tenor of Obama's speeches, and his manner in the first debate. What's wrong with nuance? The problems the two discussed are extremely complex. Nuance is appropriate; oversimplification can result in things like costly wars with no end. Besides, Obama is a gentleman, not a warrior.

That is not to say that a gentleman cannot or will not take action when necessary. The difference is that a gentleman will attempt to solve problems with out violence first. He doesn't communicate through chest-beating. A gentleman is more strategic about getting things done.

I, for one, much prefer a measured, well-considered answer to a question. Friday night was a debate, not a Toastmaster's meeting. With the position of leader of the most powerful country in the world on the line, I believe that a few ums and ahs can be forgiven.

As a nation, we have become so accustomed to celebrities who are all hype and no depth. It's been said over and over that Bush 43 is the kind of guy you'd like to have a beer with. !!!! Obama makes the point that he's not that kind of guy. And I like the difference. I want my president to be a person who inspires me. Not some yokel to play beer pong with.

It's like baseball. An X in the "win" column is considered a win -- regardless of the details of how it came to be there.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

underdog — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:09:13 GMT

reply to BillyP:, Don't really care for Sarah Palin, but, what kind of foreign poicy experience did Bill Clinton have as governor of Arkanasa? None would be pretty close to it. What kind of experience do you get with one term as a senator? Not a whole hell of a lot. Glad Barak chose Biden as a running mate. At least one person on that ticket has real experience.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

pinkpanther87413 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:10:06 GMT

YYBA1

HAVE YOU BEEN ALIVE LONG ENOUGH TO KNOW MCCAIN ONLY SAYS WHAT YOU WANT TO HEAR?? OBAMA BLERTS IT ALL OUT, HOOF IN MOUTH, BUT TRUTHFULL.

MCCAIN WILL NOT EMPLOY HIS MACRO ANY THING... AS HE SAID I,I,I, KNOW HOW! SO HOW IS HE GOING TO LISTEN, TO OR EVEN CHANGE HIS STRIPS.

I'LL AS A VETERAN TAKE THE GUY WHO SAID WE,WE,WE, WILL MAKE IT WORK,WITH EVERYONES HELP, NOT JUST ME,ME,ME,ME,!

I DO HOW EVER AGREE WITH THE BAILOUT THEY ARE SAVING THERE OWN STOCKS,NOT ANY ONES HOUSE. THE OTHER CHOICE IS TAX CUTS??? AND LIMITED GOLDEN PARACHUTES WHICH NO CEO SHOULD GET FOR FAILURE, ON THIS I TOTALY AGREE..

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:10:35 GMT

Mr. Fineman,

I find your logic interesting especially when you come up with your conclusion. You state that Sen. McCain had Sen. Obama's Uh'ing a lot. Trypically, this occurs when someone really doesnt know an answer and must think of one quickly. Granted Obama speaks well but speaking well does not replace content (or least shouldnt). I heard Obama "I agree with John" - A LOT. You speak about battles that were already ended...interesting enough Obama is the one who kept on bringing up Bush and attempting to relate the past to McCain (even when McCain opposed certain measures). Needless to say your conclusion does not match the facts.

As for opinion polls that are taken on the internet. In short they are not any type of true representation of much except for supports going to a site to do some clicking. It seems to me that the more conserative folks dont flock to opinion polls so they can show support. Again, a lack of journalistic honesty to me...

Here is one point that didnt come up when both canidates were talking about Pakistan. Obama would ignore Pakistan's rights as a nation (kinda like what Bin Laden does and a few other Arab countries and now Russia) to make an attack or kill Bin Laden. Granted a good idea in theory but what if it embodens smaller Bin Ladens all over the Arabic region? See the news lately? Pakistani troops have fired upon U.S. Forces. Interesting that Obama would say all this stuff about cooperation but would act unilaterially (uh like Bush? that Obama has complained about for his ill decision to go into Iraq.).

"Obama showed he is not presidential. When he was asked about serious financial crisis, he started this McCain-Bush punch. That's low."

This is being an opportunist.

""I HAVE A BRACELET, TOO." by Obama is the "punch line" the whole night. He is just a little copy-cat."

Obama was forced to go to Iraq by the comments of McCain saying how could he really judge anything since he had at that time never went over to Iraq to really understand. Oh wait, Obama hasnt been to Afganistan AT ALL.

Obama reversed himself on drilling for oil on the domestic offshore front (copied McCain).

Obama voted for, "However, Obama himself voted for a 2005 energy bill backed by Bush that included billions in subsidies for oil and natural gas production, a measure Cheney played a major role in developing."

Obama here in San Francisco dissed on white collared workers then turns around and embraces them.

Obama is just decietful and just dishonest.

TBH

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

greatmidwest — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:10:54 GMT

Senator Obama may not have KO'd McCain, but he sure had him up against the ropes! Obama razzle-dazzled the audience with insight regards to America's economic problems at home, and our long-standing billion dollar draining War in Iraq. Obama was sure-footed and never lost his cool, while McCain appeared tired and agitated against his younger opponent's knowledge of foregign policy and the economy. Obama's advisorrs have obviously trained him well, while McCain's are using the same old Bush play book swiped from Karl Rove...Match #1 to the Democratic Senator from ILLINOIS, OBAMA! OBAMA was fun to watch, McCain makes you want to press MUTE!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

indthinker — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:10:56 GMT

Posted by:indthinker-dragonfly777.GEE , WHEN DID READING BOOKS OTHER THAN THE HARDY BOYS AND NANCY DREW BECOME A BAD THING. WHEN WE READ BOOKS DOES OUR MIND ABSORB AND ASSIMILATE THROUGH OSMOSIS ? OR IS ONE SUPPOSE TO THINK AND BE REFLECTIVE (PARTICULARILY WHEN DEALING WITH RELIGION OR POLITICS)

i WONDER WHAT YOUR THOUGHTS WOULD BE ABOUT THOSE WHO READ "MINE KAMPH"

DOES IT MEAN THEY ASPIRE TO TAKE OVER THE WORLD? OR IS IT A THIRST FOR KNOWLEDGE SO THAT ONE CAN BECOME INFORMED..RATHER THAN REGERGITATE PHILOSOPHIES ...& WELL HE SAID. CHECK OUT PASTOR THOMAS MUTHEE (PALINS PASTOR) CHECK OUT THE "THIRD WAVE MOVEMENT AND PALINS CONVICTIONS AND BELIEFS - WANNA GET FRIGHTENED OR PARANOID.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

7dollars — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:12:28 GMT

john mc cain...the last great white hope.

when john mc cain hits the deck i'll laugh.

war, hate, debt, fear...that's those republicans for you, folks!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

SandyLo — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:12:55 GMT

Regarding Obamas three statements during the debate agreeing with McCain, did anyone see the ad that the McCain campaign produced within 30 minutes of the end of the debate? It said "Is Barak Obama really ready to be President?" and then played the three clips of Obama saying the first part of each of his three "agreement statements" , such as "John is actually correct about the.... " "John you are right in this case about..."

The narrator then says "No" in a convincing soft voice.

Why is conceding that McCain has just made a correct point is a bad thing? People of character and good judgment do that !! McCain on the other hand was in full attack mode. He also didn't look at Obama at all.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

clikdawg — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:16:11 GMT

Thocoe --

Depends on your definition of "knock-out"; and since it's my slant that the whole election is a dog-and-pony show, the following Wikipedia account of Ali/Liston II may (or may not) prove instructive:

“The ending of the second fight remains one of the most controversial in boxing history. Midway through the first round, Liston fell to the canvas, in what many have argued was not a legitimate knockdown. Referee Jersey Joe Walcott, a former world heavyweight champion himself, appeared confused after Ali refused to retreat to a neutral corner. Instead, Ali stood over his fallen opponent, gesturing and yelling at him to get up. The moment was captured by ringside photographer Neil Leifer, and has become one of the iconic images of sport. Ali then posed over him, with his fists in the air celebrating the knockdown.

“While Walcott tried to sort out the situation, 20 seconds passed, and by then Liston had gotten to his feet and resumed boxing. Nat Fleischer, publisher of The Ring, finally alerted Walcott that Liston had spent more than the requisite 10 seconds on the canvas, and Walcott stopped the fight — awarding Ali a first-round knockout (see Muhammad Ali).

“The blow that ended the match became known as "the phantom punch," so named because most people at ringside did not see it. Slow motion replays show Ali connecting with a quick, chopping right to Liston's head as Liston was moving toward him, and show that Liston was unsteady when he finally got to his feet. (Ali appeared to connect with four additional unanswered punches before Walcott belatedly declared the knockout, ending the contest.) However, whether the blow was a genuine knockout punch remains inconclusive.[4]

“There were claims that Liston had bet against himself and "took a dive" because he owed money to the Mafia. Others believe that he feared for his safety from Nation of Islam extremists who supported Ali. The latter theory was supported by Mark Kram's book Ghosts of Manila, which included an interview with Liston conducted years after the fight. Liston claimed to have intentionally lost because of his fear of retaliation from the Black Muslims. No independent substantiation of this claim has come to light.”

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

RRuin — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:16:30 GMT

McCain has indeed been most elegantly KO'd by Barack Obama.

He just doesn't know it yet.

Obama is the future and McCain only remains standing because he's so rooted in the past that he is too ossified to fall.

McCain will crumble bit by bit, blow by blow until his lies and McNasty brand of politics are dust.

Obama/Biden 08 Choose the Future

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:18:22 GMT

"Senator Obama may not have KO'd McCain, but he sure had him up against the ropes! Obama razzle-dazzled the audience with insight regards to America's economic problems at home, and our long-standing billion dollar draining War in Iraq. Obama was sure-footed and never lost his cool, while McCain appeared tired and agitated against his younger opponent's knowledge of foregign policy and the economy. Obama's advisorrs have obviously trained him well, while McCain's are using the same old Bush play book swiped from Karl Rove...Match #1 to the Democratic Senator from ILLINOIS, OBAMA! OBAMA was fun to watch, McCain makes you want to press MUTE!"

What play book is that?

Obama's reversals and copy-cat nature?

Perhaps start a War with Pakistan who has nukes? Maybe they would send a nuke our way in a suit case after Obama killed Bin Laden without Pakistans invovlment just to show the world how stupid a president could be?

You people ever think beyond your noses or the moment?

TBH

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

pinkpanther87413 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:18:39 GMT

MCCAIN RELIES ON HIMSELF

OBAMA RELIES ON EVERYONE, WHO KNOWS MOR,E AND LISTENS AND CHOSES THE BEST FOR THE JOB, NOT EXCATLY A ME,ME,ME,ME TYPE OF GUY! A GENTELMAN HE IS, THE LACK OF THE KEATING 5 AND MCCAIN PROVES THIS!

MCCAIN ALMOST GOT TO SHOW THE WORLD HIS TEMPER, BUT WE DID GET A GOOD SHOW OF IT IN SM AMOUNTS, LIKE EVERY COMMENT. I'VE NEVER SEEN ANYONE GRIND THERE TEETH SO HARD, EXCEPT IN AN INTEROGATION ROOM!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

pinkpanther87413 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:21:46 GMT

RRUIN

YOU MEAN THE ONLY WAY TO GET MCCAIN TO TRULY FLIP FLOP PHY., IS TO PLUG HIM INTO A 110 VOLT OUTLET. LOL,LOL FLIP FLOPPING VERBALY HE DOES ON HIS MEDS!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

7dollars — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:21:59 GMT

mc cain is no hero...

mc cain never faced an enemy combatant face to face in his military career.

mc cain dropped 500 lb. bombs on women and children in vietnam

while flying 30,000 ft. in the air.

what kind of hero is that?

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

jpluto52 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:23:37 GMT

As with everything else with minorities there has to be a doubling of everything to complete. Frankly, it makes no difference to me who becomes president, but I do know that I want someone who will think before sending other people to die based upon a lie. Obama was critized for travelling over seas because the people there don't vote, but now because John McCain is supposed to be foriegh policy expert that's given more credibility, why those people still don't vote here. Maybe you as a supporter of John McCain, can give me one thing, outside of John McCain wearing this country's uniform, that makes him a real hero. What military strategy has John McCain planned and executed that resulted in a benefit to this country? Keep in mind when you seek an answer, those five planes he crashed, and the fact that he finished 894 out of 899 at the naval academy. This country has already had a "c" student and you see where that got us, now you want to put an "f" student in his place.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Arthur Bello — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:25:51 GMT

I agree most entirely with Howaard's analysis. I watched Sen Obama in utter disbelief, especially considering the expectation we had of him after the domos convention in which he openly and boastfully called for a debate. I expected he wwould tie Sen McCain to all his rabble rousing acitivities that preceeded the debate. Th "fundamentals of our economy is strong" and yet he supposedly suspended his ccampaign becausse of the "economic crisis". Are we all Georgians now? If there is any two words that characterises Sen McCains judgement and policy initiatives, they are poor and raash. These are reflected in the kinds of deicions he has made of late including the Sarah Palin's choice. Calling him a maverick is giving dog a bad name. He is nothing but intemperate.He is is therefore not a fit and proper persson to be in th Whit House.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

arabeguiled — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:27:06 GMT

no need to try to delude yourself into some muddled sense of acquiencent acceptance. obama lost

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

ObamaRama — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:34:39 GMT

Howard,

You and the gang at MSNBC, except for Olbermann and Maddow, seem to have gotten it all wrong. Obama showed himself to be the more presidential of the two, McCann couldn't even bring himself to look at Obama in the eye throughout the debate. And the sharp jabs to Obama you mention were returned in kind. Obama was much more solid and cool while McCain looked like the old, petulant and mired in the past politician that he indeed is. I got tired of hearing about the countries he's been too, after his nearly thirty years in the Senate we all know he's taken his share of taxpayer financed junkets. In a word, he was boring.

As to the economy, I heard little from McCain regarding the middle class of this country. What I did here is business taxcuts and a freeze on most spending except for defense, not surprising coming from an old warhawk like him. perhaps this lack of mention is why more women, by a large margin, gave the debate to Obama. Last night McCain was sadly more of the same, more of the same dogmatic politics that got this country into the mess it is in, with no foresight into a changing world.

I don't know what you talking heads were expecting from this debate, but I've got to wonder if you saw what a large percentage of the rest of the audience saw.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

DEBTWARRIOR — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:38:19 GMT

Come on now? You know the first debate is the First Round of any Title Fight. Each Pugilist feels the other out, a jab here, a right cross there and the occaisional upper-cut attempt. This Debate was Political Pugilism at it's finest.

I think Senator Obama used the 'Rope-A-Dope' strategy. Obama pulled a lot of powerful punches, like he did with Senator Clinton. Senator Obama knows that there is a [racial] double standard for a Black American running for President.. Among many Americans of every race and culture Obama has to 'Over-Come' not knock out right away. He had to come off as the Challenger overcoming the Champion as opposed to the Champion crushing the Challenger.

A brutal bead-down of a so called War Hero, would have been ugly and would threaten the Anglo Socioeconomic Cast-System of the entire Baby-Boomer Generation. If Barack would have knocked John out in the First Debate {First Round], Senator Obama would have come off like Mike Tyson in the ring against the proverbial Great White Hope. Senator McCain would be able to play the Underdog Card and shore up the GOP's willingness to cheer on an obviously flawed Candidate. Oxymoron addicted to Oxycontin" Neo-Talker Rush Limbaugh, said that John McCain was an old Cancer Sore of the GOP (at least that's what Rush's rants about John McCain sounded like to me)."

With that said, Round Two must produce a knock-out moment for both Political Pugilists.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

jpluto52 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:38:31 GMT

"arabeguiled" Tell me one solid thing John McCain has done for this country outside of wearing the uniform. After capature, McCain exchanged military information for medical treatment. If McCain had not been in the habit of crashing planes, he would not have gotten capatured. Five planes, bottom of the class 894 at the naval academy. You need to research government documents before you go around calling people a hero. His, mcCain"s, inability to use a computer is only one simple thing of many, many complex things he can't do.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sunbluei — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:43:27 GMT

Excuse me, but did you watch the debate. You don't know "beans" about what you are talking about, clearly Obama won. Pehaps you want a "hot head" for a president like McCain, but I don't. War is the only thing on his mind and I am sick to death of leader going to war. Repbublicans had their chance and they blew it. You need to find a new job, or learn to keep your personal opinions at home they don't belong in an article. OBAMA FOR PRESIDENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Dem on a mission — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:43:29 GMT

Honestly, haven't we had enough testosterone soaked policy and commentary? As citizens in a democracy, we are not here to watch gladiators but to choose the smartest and most thoughtful, informed, and honest leader we can find. We are voting for the future of our country. What we do in this election will have impact on the world. Please stop trivializing it by looking for "knockout punches" and macho posturing. I agree completely with boogistik, michaeldsellars, sedonakaren, and aguasticas.

Here is my take:

Obama looked and sounded presidential, informed, confident, and gracious. His answers were clearer and more succinct than in past debates. He looked directly into the camera, and his body language was serious but friendly.

He gave a good coherent 4-point summary of the bailout requirements, made the critical points about his tax plan, was aggressive about McCain's bad judgment about starting and prolonging the Iraq war, was explicit that no matter how much you drill the domestic oil supply just won't meet our needs, and ended with the importance of restoring American's image and leadership in the world. He even managed to work in references to McCain's "bomb, bomb, bomb Iran" song and McCain's confusion about meeting with the prime minister of Spain.

Obama did, however, miss a couple of opportunities -- but there will be other debates.

-- He let McCain center the economic bailout question on earmarks, instead of dismissing that issue more quickly and saying that McCain's solution to the entire economic crisis, after cutting federal spending, is MORE tax cuts and MORE deregulation, exactly the policies that created this mess -- and how absurd is that?!

-- Lehrer gave Obama an open invitation to link the economic problems to national security, but he didn't emphasize that idea -- that real national military security MUST be founded on economic security and broad prosperity.

-- I truly wish SOMEONE would pin McCain down on what he thinks "victory" and "defeat" mean in Iraq and what those definitions might imply for US engagement there. Obama did not highlight McCain's central foreign policy delusion, which McCain finally stated late in the debate -- namely, that he believes all wars are winnable and we should never quit because leaving equals defeat. (The lesson he brought home from his Vietnam experience.)

-- Obama didn't call McCain -- when McCain brought up the subjects -- on his votes AGAINST funding for vets, education, health care, and the environment and AGAINST banning torture.

McCain was much better than I expected and better than he has been in past debates.But he seemed tightly wound, peevish, and at times actually contemptuous of Obama. He never looked him in the face, even when he was shaking his hand.

Finally, who CARES what Henry Kissinger thinks or says?!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

flyinmango — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:43:35 GMT

Senator Obama's KO punch comes on November 4th...WE THE PEOPLE are the final punch to his lead...I predict Republicans will be "down for the ocunt" in an election of monumental proportions with through the roof turnout. Obama is the future, sees through a prism unlike anyone before him, and with our help, this USA will again be the beacon in the night for all future generations!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

white trash — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:48:29 GMT

Well, Obama could have lurched over the podium like a thug with a mad-on, ready to kick Iran and Russia's demonic behinds as a centuries old international, imperialistic bully, Conversely, Obama's knock-out punch was his presidential presence, superior reasoning, cool under fire, superb eloquence and articulation and superlative command of the English language, which illustrated Obama is ready to move into the new century and support bipartisan issues while remaining ever so presidential.

However, it is apparent, the majority of Americans just love America's image as the planet's big, bad bullies. If he isn't a boxer with the gloves on, he is incapable of delivering an intellectual punch however so subtle, like all the reasons USA invaded & conquered a defenseless nation for no valid reasoning, and with the punch, a knock-out blow to America's economy. We would have thought that Reagan and Nixon were the second coming of America's religious icon, both of whom were as evolved and new century as Mac and his simmering, uncontrolled temper. As Mac wouldn't even look at Obama, I think his knock-out punch was close to being a knock-out punch. Ole Mac has a nasty and mean temper. Such a swaggering, banty rooster; the only item missing was the dark little cave in the background and Mac's chest thumping. Uga, kill, kill, kill!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

7dollars — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:52:02 GMT

john mc cain & george bush schemed how to lie america into a useless war.

without a war...john mc cain is nothing.

john mc cain...george bush...two peas in a pod.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

SteveKelson — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:52:52 GMT

I see the GOP spin team is out in force again today, madly blazing away in the basement of the Karl Rove building. They start 'em young over there, in the typing pool. This makes them more effective as future lobbists.

I hope most can see through their act.

(Shalom, Yehoshua Ya'acov US Citizen Living Abroad in Jerusalem) ...yeah, right!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

pinkpanther87413 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:00:14 GMT

ALOT OF YOU ALL TOOK ACCEPTION TO OBAMAS INTERUPTIONS.

YOU TELL ME THE TRUTH IF YOU WERE STANDING IN FRONT OF MILLIONS AND THE GUY NEXT TO YOU IS RATTLIG OFF A TON OF MISINTERPETED BS, YOUR TRYING TO TELL ME YOU WOULD NOT INTERUPT,TAKE OFFENCE,STAND UP FOR YOURSELF AND KNOW IT WOULD TAKE ALL NIGHT TO ANSWER HIS ACUSATIONS. THAT YOU WOULD NOT HAVE INTERUPTED, A PROVEN DISTORTED TRASHING OF YOU??? DON'T LIE, THAT'S MCCAINS JOB.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Protruth08 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:05:25 GMT

The "punch" that Obama missed was in reaction to McCain's remarks about the situation of meeting with adversaries without preconditions. McCain became agitated to the point of starting to reveal his underlying temper when he remarked how ridiculous and inappropriate having dialogue with adversaries is without preconditions - as Obama supported. I saw this as a slip-up of sorts where McCain openly flaunted his true steadfast support for the Bush/Cheney foreign policy mentality that has never worked, the, "We're not talking unless you do XYZ first, so until then, F-You!" Obama should have hammered back on McCain that he was clearly demonstrating his true foreign policy stance of business as usual with that response and position. No change there.

McCain was once a "maverick" when he worked within the Republican ranks. However, as its new "leader", I believe he is now so beholden to the Republican agenda that he can no longer flaunt his previous "maverick" record and be taken seriously, and so his message of change rings more and more hollow as a result.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

American Asian Mom — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:08:57 GMT

Obama provided complex responses to complex issues. What scares me the most is McCain's simplistic approach to problems. If they don't agree with us, bomb' em. If they don't listen to us - ignore'em. We are living in a global world where many complex issues exist. I want a president who is willing to think before he acts. If I want someone who reacts "hotly and without forethought", I would vote for my brother-in-law who is currently in prison. To top this off, McCain has a VP who is just as arrogant, uninformed, and rash as he is. Obama for President!!!!!!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sunra — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:13:09 GMT

jpluto52's statement, "This country has already had a "c" student and you see where that got us, now you want to put an "f" student in his place." say it all... Bravo.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

adamhnadir — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:14:16 GMT

I lived in Europe for years and learned a very valuable diference between Europeans and us Americans. They avoid laying think cheeze on every thing, and they don't have phrases like "constructive criticism" or "every one is a winner". Despite that they are still far more sophisticated in thought and cogniscent in actions. After watching the debate, I thought to myself wo he did delay or held back many good punches that would have metaphorically bled McCain's brain. So, why not. But I like Howard's comments last night when he explained that it was the "O'Bama style..that's the gentlemanly way of doing things". Frankly, I couldn't agree more with notion. As Americans we are sick and tired of Bush and McCain hypocracy. And, I am old enough to know that a guy who ownes multiple homes and cars and other riches simply wouldn't and couldn't relate to an average middle class American. It is a con and McCain is good at this non sense. His "de-regulation" mantra is the primary reason we are in this messs now.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Change '08 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:16:52 GMT

" Posted By: A Believer (September 27, 2008 at 4:40 PM)

Please get your statistics right, Mississippi is 40% black. Obama can not pronounce the names? McCain the great foreign policy expert mispronounced two names dear.

I find it ironic and somewhat sad that it is seen as a bad thing to acknowledge or agree with someone. What kind of world do we live that being dignified and tactful is seen as to "cool'!! I thought McCain did well on his home turf on foreign policy but he did not knock Obama out the box like he should have being such an expert. Obama held his own and stood his ground throughout the 90 minutes, without disdain or contempt for his opponent. He engaged McCain, looked at him and tried to keep him to the facts. Honestly, how often do we have to hear the POW story? We get it and America thanks you for your courage and strength during those times but we need more than a war hero to lead us out of this mess. How long do we have to hear his rhetoric of the "past" We need to get out of the past and move toward the future, a brighter future. We need someone with good judgment and McCain your first round of bad judgment is your VP pick. You are supposed to be about Country First, yet you pick someone that is just not ready to lead this country. "Well she is only the VP, she is not running for Pres" People, really? She is a heartbeat away and McCain is not getting younger, SHE IS NOT READY! How can we trust someone like that? You get high and mighty about earmarks but your own VP pick state has the highest out of the 50?!? Something just is not adding up. We need someone in there that is ready to work for ALL of the people and get us back as the most respected country in the world. We have lost a lot these last 8 years and we just can not afford anymore of the philosophy of the Bush Admin.

Obama/Biden '08

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Cazador1972 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:16:58 GMT

I could not agree more. I watched the debate with my local pro-Obama group and we all agreed that although more or less even, McCain had him "on points". I'm a boxer myself so I also think using these these metaphors.

What I found frustrating was Obama's refusal to take McCain to task, and that is why originally I supported Hillary and not him. This "noble" attitude of staying above the fray doesn't click with me because if you eventually lose this is the kind of thing you wish you had done differently, In my book, you know you've defeated your opponent when he can't get up. If anyone thinks if Obama's approach is effective, ask senator Kerry, he might beg to differ. I had flashbacks of the '04 election when I screamed at the TV everyday making the arguments the Democratic candidate should've been making. I understand you want to look presidential and not like "an angry black man" which is something the right wing could use, but you CANNOT ALLOW BALONEY TO GO UNCHALLENGED. When McCain said "My veterans know I will take care of them" Obama should have said that McCain himself was vehemently opposed to Senator Webb's bill which would increase aid to the veterans. Hillary Clinton would have taken McCain to task with that. When McCain said he opposed torture, I saw red when Obama didn't challenge his flip-flapping BACK AND FORTH on this. This is just beyond comprehension, especially on an election which is a) so critical and b) so close. Obama doesn't have a 20 point lead to pretend to be magnanimous, he has a small lead he could lose at any moment.

The consensus is that Obama did better than McCain, as an Obama supporter I am glad to hear that. But I'm not happy to win by an edge when I could have easily won decisively. He has already shown he can be tough without looking like a thug. The Obama campaign doesn't see a penny from me unless I start seeing some grit.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

dolfina — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:18:29 GMT

I think we will see more of the k.o. as time goes on. With the economy in the tank, everyone is playing the gentleman. Wait until Binden debates Peggy Hill...er, Sarah Palin, it'll be all about sytle. As for as Palin goes, they ususally go away just talking about her shoes and glasses. Hot topics!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

justanothervet — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:21:37 GMT

The punch that noone saw or ever could see thrown by Ali "The Great One", "The mouth", who lost his title to Frasier, Norton, Holmes and was beaten by others. Ali ends his life with no brains just as he started -"A mind is a terrible thing to waste".Obama like Ali has a mouth is a traitor and failed to deliver the hole package.Obama can't finish either. Obama can't close the deal.Obama lost to McCain twice in a row and will loose agin becuse he sings and dances when he should be delivering the knock-out punch.If Obama wins he will look around and say "Now what do I do".

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

adamhnadir — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:21:44 GMT

I think for those that still sing songs of capitalism, I got news: The most cultured and socialy advancing nations at the moment Japan, Western Europe, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, Indonesia...and a few others ALL follow a socialistic model..tweeked towards a capitalistic frame work. The meshing new configuration of such "fool proof" economic model is that humanity's good can be enhanced by capital wealth distribution.

Now, if you reverse this model, and review it..you simply get a clear explanation of why and what is wrong of modern America and why did Wall Street end up raping our own nation's security.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Cazador1972 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:23:34 GMT

Adamhadir, I hear you brother, but talk to John Kerry and Michael Dukakis, they were two noble gentleman who fought a clean fight but lost to more street smart, savvy politicians and which made this country suffered a lot as a consequence. This is not Obama's fight only, this is our fight as well and I for one want to win. Further, Obama calling McCain on his lies (torture and veteran benefits) is the gentlemanly thing to do, there's nothing ignoble in that.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

mondayschild — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:35:06 GMT

Ever since Obama announced that he would run for president, newspapers and screaming pundits made prediction upon prediction about his candidacy. They said he wouldn’t last. The Clintons were amused at this African American candidate, who dared to take them on. This young whippersnapper from Chicago apparently didn’t know about their political power, and the army of friends who backed them. So it was no big deal to entertain Barack Obama, the same way the media and Stepford Pundits tolerated the candidacy of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton. Anyway, Obama was doomed to vanish in a cloud of dust before the primaries commenced. Hillary, baptized and cleansed of her previous sins by the media, was destined to get the Democratic nomination. Hillary and her campaign kicked back, relaxed their minds, ate catered lunches, drank the best of coffee and spent money with reckless abandon.

The “inexperienced” Senator Barack Obama, a one-speech wonder, using his community organizational skills, began putting together his small city of grassroots supporters. He surrounded himself with brilliant minds and eager volunteers who wanted to make a difference. While Clinton was focused on looking straight ahead, she forgot to periodically look over her shoulder. Too bad. Obama T-Boned her. He began winning primaries in states that he was supposed to lose. Along the way, desperation stepped in, and Hillary began to embellish campaign stories that couldn’t withstand the FactCheck test. Hillary, Bill and the campaign staff got angry at the media. They said it was favorable to Obama. One day, she broke down and cried. in public. The tears didn’t work for me. It was unbecoming. Hilary Clinton is the Maragret Thatcher of America. She had already shown how strong she is. She could roll with the verbal punches, and she could part with a stinging jab herself. Unfortunately for her, Obama could take a knockdown jab, and come up smiling. Nonetheless, Hillary proved that she could hold her own in the all-boys club. When the curtain closed and reopened, Obama was on stage alone, taking his bow, accepting his party’s nomination for president of the United States.

The copycat media and loud mouthed pundits stepped up their attacks on Obama and Michelle. I can’t remember any presidential candidate undergoing such scrutiny as Obama. Unbelievable gossip spread like a virus on the Internet. Every radio puke on the air attacked Obama mercilessly. They still are. Sean Hannity is going to have a stroke on TV. And if you can believe it, they even pretended to be in love with Hillary! The transparent scheme was to get Hillary the nomination, so she would run against the Republican nominee. Conservatives had unlocked the storage door, ready to start rummaging through the bevy of juicy scandals. Let the smear campaign began! Bring out Monica, Jennifer and Paula!

The final stages of this historical election are in motion. Obama held his own at the first presidential debate on Friday night. McCain, the media and pundits favorite, came across flustered and mocking. Holding on to his natural coolness and intelligence, it was Obama who appeared presidential. He didn’t have to build himself, by taking five-cent shots at McCain, who couldn’t hide his disdain. I am elated to see that through this long ordeal, the print media and screaming pundits have not achieved their main goal. That was to turn Barack Obama into an “angry black man”, rendering him incapable of being president of the U.S.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

luispando — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:40:37 GMT

I have heard this stuff since the primary. Why can't Obama not knockout Hillary? Why can't Obama knockout McCain? Well I have a question for you. Why can't either of them beat a black guy named Barack Obama? That should be the real question.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

freedog007 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:46:33 GMT

Our country is so dissatissfied with our congress and our country at the moment, we are on the edge of voting in an individual for two reasons: 1. He made a speech against the war 2. he is black We are ignoring the fact that this man, as admirable as he is, has no proven track record on the economy, he never served in the military and he has no foreign policy experience. We have a very complicated world and Obama is just not ready when it comes to taking the controls. Stop, think, vote McCain.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

real-vermonter — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:03:08 GMT

Howard Fineman gets it as to Obama's style.....civility. And Fineman all but admits that the press doesn't like it. They want a "fight." They want to talk about who gets in the best "jab" and who "counterblows" the best. They want someone to strike a "knockout." They want to divide the country into two fighting camps, (not the Civil War's blue and the gray, but the blue and the red). Americans are not used to seeing civility in public discourse of late. It is new and I like it. McCain came across as angry and a bully in the debate. We have been there. We have done that. My t-shirt says....no house, no job, no hope. Our country is all but despised abroad due to this "pugnacious" attitude. I am looking forward to getting a new t-shirt.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

blaggfield — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:03:27 GMT

I think the last thing Obama would want to show is an angry back man striking out at an old white man.

Don't forget Obama's sport is basketball not boxing. And in basketball the last thing you want to do is let your opponent get to you in a close game and get you to foul yourself out of the game. So he might not have the knock out punch but my money would be on Obama at the foul line. Swish!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

reneekuhl — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:09:31 GMT

If you want to know what the problem is, look at your own words.

"Maybe voters are fed up with leaders who start wars without studying the possible consequences." OF COURSE WE ARE. You're a voter, Fineman. AREN'T YOU? Our "leaders" never should have gotten away with these things in the first. And it's eight years of articles like these that contributed to the problem. The truth is, media men like yourself loved the way George W Bush brandished his guns without reason: it made your job easy, and it made for great TV. And when you should have been asking the right questions, you stood on the sidelines, waving your money in the air while he won round after round. Unfortunately, it wasn't the "Axis of Evil" who got laid out: It was the American people. I think you'll get your knockout, sir and when it matters most: On November 4th. Personally, I don't care if it comes like the thrill of the fight or the calm of the tide: I want peace. I want security. I want change. I have had enough of info-tainment.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

DelicateMonster — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:10:01 GMT

In answer to freedog007

Yeah. He's also smarter than freedog007--certainly smarter and more nuanced than whathisname, POW and Miss Heartland USA.

Oh, he happens to also be black. Dude, that's just added value.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

elizabethpaige — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:18:05 GMT

Sen. Obama is charm personified. Luckily, he also has superior intellect and judgment. No need for Sen. Obama to resort to butchery when he has the skill of a surgeon.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

terry t — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:23:00 GMT

Just imagine if the "liberal newspapers" were actually conservative in 2000 election. Imagine how they would have proclaimed the working of the law of the land and how it's the Electoral College numbers that elect a president and not the most votes. How about a system where the most state who voed for the President counted? Again President Bush would have won. But alas that isn't how it has been for the past 8 years. President Bush has beaten the best the dems threw at him even though he has been called an idiot and worse by the press, which begs the question what level of intelligence the other side has? Mc Cain was the aggressor and won on points, period.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

mmbmiscione — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:33:44 GMT

I watched the debate earnestly last night. I do not agree with you regarding your comments that Obama did not "attack" when he could have. In honestly, I just don't get why journalists are harping on that point. Winning a debate does not necessarily mean that you have to hammer your oppointment to a pulp. To me , winning the debate means that you have successfully responded to your challenger's charrges. Obama did that time and time again - and he did it with the calm efficient manner of someone who knows and believes in what he is saying.Besides, I don't think this country needs an "Ali" for president. We already have a team that strikes first and asks questions later... and oh yeah, if they trhrow in a few lies who cares? Watching Obama maintain his composure and respond intelligently while McCain contemptiously attemped to deamean him proved to me that this is the man I want to represent us for the next four years. Perhaps he won't get everything right but what we will get is someone who seems to understand both the needs of the people domestically and the needs of the country as we attempt to once again take our place in the world. Over the last eight years under the Republicans and George Bush we have lost so much more than our economic security. I only hope the American people can see through the nosnsense of McCain and his team. I suggest before they attack the Obama campaign they should look to their own campaign and their own people who certainly are not

innocent bystanders in the events that led us to this time and this place.

It is time for a change - I pray Americans opt for the right change.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

clikdawg — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:34:52 GMT

OK, let's quit screwing around. Obama supporters, please explain -- right now -- why you think we can win in Afghanistan, based on its history, terrain, socio-political dynamics, agricultural tendencies, and ethnic/religious make-up. "We got to " and "'Cause Barack says so" are NOT legitimate responses.

In short, why is trading a costly, futile, endless war in Iraq for a costly, futile, and endless war in Afghanistan a Good Idea? And why should I vote for anyone who says it is?

McCain supporters, please explain -- right now -- why continuing to bleed the nation's coffers, military posture and flexibility, and credibility in Iraq is preferable to bleeding them in Afghanistan. Same rules of legitimacy apply.

Failure by either or both camps to respond will be considered a frank admission of strategic AND tactical bankruptcy, as well as a concession that the election so far has only succeeded in giving the American people a choice -- not between war and peace, but between one stupid, unwinnable war and another.

Y'all understand the meaning of the word "co-opted"? "Cause that is precisely -- courtesy of Your Two Major Parties -- what the sane, forward-looking drive towards Middle Eastern disengagement has been ...

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

dermr — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:39:55 GMT

I have a bracelet, too.

Is that embarrasing for his fan????????????????????

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

SaM44 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:41:35 GMT

I, for one, appreciate a candidate that is above a "KO" that some seem to feel is required to gain an advantage. His intellegence and leadership qualities speak louder than any "punch" and exactly what this country needs. It is 2008 and time to move beyond the antiquated "cowboy" attitude and be a forward thinking country. As stated by Albert Einstein, "We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sarahs121 — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:44:29 GMT

McCain clearly won the debate. How any one can say that Obama won is beyond me. McCain SPANKED Obama and did it with class. Obama constantly interrupted McCain and called him repeatedly by his first name (sometimes not the right one!) instead of by his title, Senator. McCain was much more respectful than Obama but still mopped the floor with him. I was embarrassed for Obama. He was not even answering the questions but was instead spouting off lines his advisors had made him memorize. McCain sauntered in all cool and confident and answered his questions based on experience and real-life knowledge. Definitely came across as the most qualified Commander in Chief. Obama scared me with his talk of invading Paksistan. Is he an idiot?? He says we can't afford Iraq but we sure can't afford to go to war with Pakistan right now. My husband is active duty career military and when he talked about invading Pakistan I almost came out of m skin thinking what that would mean. Obama based his entire qualifications for being POTUS on his decision to oppose the Iraq war (which is so easy to say when he wasn't even a Senator at the time so it is a moot point) but now talks cavalierly about invading Pakistan?? McCain was right to take him to task for that. But even though McCain cleary won the media try to convince us all that Obama did. The Emperor has no clothes people....wake up!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

LLHCA — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:55:20 GMT

Obama is the statesman, the articulate one, the calm on the trigger finger. And yes, he is qualified, just look at his resume. Joe Biden is brilliant and surely all of the cabinet members that Mr. Obama would appoint (not to mention Justices) would bring about a return to the global standing that we Americans so graciously had when we were a true leader. As for the debate, I ask you to ask yourself a few simple questions; How many times did Mccain say "I" and how many times did Mr. Obama say "we"? Did you look at Mccain as an old workhorse that is respected for his work in the field and see Mr. Obama as the new, more viable, more focused on the here and now and better to lead us in these new challanges? I did. Come on Americans. Be American.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

BoogieStik — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 23:58:52 GMT

Here's a great followup article to this one:

http://jamesfallows.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/09/on_strategy_and_tactics.php

Synopsis: Trying to make it stick, McCain kept repeating a "Obama doesn't understand" theme. Part of that effort was the assertion that Obama doesn't understand the difference between tactics and strategy. But it's precisely an appreciation for the need to employ strategy rather than just tactics that leads Obama to withhold "going for the KO", while McCain's favoring of tactics over strategy explains why he so often appears to be erratic.

The effectiveness of Obama's strategy thus far is readily apparent for all to see.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

mokolo12 — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 00:18:13 GMT

clearly speaking OBAMA WON, AMERICA NEEDS A PRESIDENT WHO IS INTELLIGENT NOT A FIGHTER . IF WE CA NMAINTAIN PEACE SO MANY LIVES WOULD BE SAVE. MCCAIN TURNED ME OFF, REPEATING THESE, OBAMA DOESN'T UNDERSTAND, HE DOESN'T GET IT TIME AND AGAIN , HE DID BEHAVED LIKE A TOTAL IDOIT, HE WAS MAKING A FOOL OF HIMSELVE WITH A TALKING POINT.

MCCAIN YOU ARE TOO OLD, GONE ARE THE DAYS OF OLD POLITIC SENATOR. THIS COUNTRY NEED A SOLVE SPEAKING, AND REPECTFUL PRESIDENT WHO KNOWNS FAMILY VALUES AND REPECT WOMEN.

AMERICA NEEDS TO GAIN IT SUPERIORITY IN THE WORLD AND WITH OBAMA/BIDEN THAT WOULD BE VERY POSIBLE. TWO MEN WHO REPECT THEIR WIFES. MY BLESSING TO YOU .

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

OlEd — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 00:20:43 GMT

In the Old West, the original definition of a "maverick" was a little calf that had lost its' mother, or had become separated from its' mother. So, I guess John is a REAL MAVERICK.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

onepoker — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 00:30:44 GMT

I have heard that it was a tie so that means Obama won. And now I have heard he didn't lose so that means he won. When are you guys going to acknowledge that Obama is supposedly the great speaker and yet he has nothing to say. I Haven't heard any leadership from Obama on anything. He simply dances around the issues and takes whatever position appears to be more appealing to his audience. Remember how anti war he was just a few months ago against Hillary? Now he is all about sending every body we have to afganistan.

One incredible miss by MCCain was he went to Washington to shake up the 700billiion dollar taxpayer bloodbath and he succeeded yet he didn't take any credit he merely said he sided with the house republicans. He should of stood up and told everyone why he went there which was to make sure America wasn't bamaboozled into sending 700 billion to the bastards that nearly destroyed this country. Did anyone on the news mention that the democrats had slipped in a provisions where 20% of the money would go straight into a government housing program. That would of permanently grown government by 140 billion dollars and no one reported it!!!

A better poster for Obamas wall might be of the 2007 patriots.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

icarusinbrazil@yahoo.com — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:00:35 GMT

To deliver the knock out punch in the first debate would not be agood approach for Obama. Nor would it be wise because it gives McCain time to recover. Many people saw Obama closely for the first or second time during the first debate. For them to see a young black man attacking a "war hero" might not have made a good early impression. Obama is a writer. Writers set up their ducks n the beginning--and knock them down in the end. Obama is laying the groundwork for McCain's demise. Then McCain will become the stinking corpse he is so fond of talking about.

BTW: When exactly was nuclear Pakistan as failed state? How many points did McCain get for that invention?

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

icarusinbrazil@yahoo.com — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:01:19 GMT

BTW: When exactly was nuclear Pakistan as failed state? How many points did McCain get for that invention? It reminds me of the day President Ford liberated Eastern Europe.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

EmleeL — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:05:53 GMT

mokolo12 - where do you get the idea that McCain does not respect women? Obama is the one who has made belittling sexist remarks during his campaign against Hillary not McCain.......

The debate was disappointing - neither candidate showed well in my opinion, nothing new just the same old stuff we have heard before - Obama desperately trying to make McCain into Bush and McCain trying to show how inexperienced Obama is. Obama is clearly a very intelligent person, but I have to ask - is one term as a US Senator really enough experience to be President of the United States when we are faced with the issues at hand? And he has spent the last year campaigning not even working as a Senator.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Independent23 — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:06:14 GMT

Newsweek is acting almost 100% that it is the Campaign arm of Barack Obama. Amazing. Where is the Journalism ethics? The same article could have been written as John McCain is no Mohammad Ali when it comes to closing. In experienced OBAMA, just being touted by the Media as the Greatest Ever & the Greatest Orator but an empty suit, should have been knocked out by the Country First Patriot McCain. I know that is partisan. Why can't you guys do your job as journalist s instead of trying to sway the election to your likening. It is going to blow up like a wall street bail out crisis.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Cleareye — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:07:23 GMT

Obama seemed to be going soft on the old guy from Arizona and needs to understand that McCain will cut his throat if give a chance. This is not a pickup game at a playground, he must go for the jugular. McCain is actual weak on Iraq and the 'surge' that is only appearing to work as long as we pay off the enemy. Bush, with McCain's help got suckered into Iraq by the Iranians who have benefited enormously by I our foolhardy leaders ignorance of the middle east. McCain is holding the bag with Bush and must be called to account.

And who listens to Kissinger about anything since he got our ass whipped in Viet Nam.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

icarusinbrazil@yahoo.com — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:09:28 GMT

onepoker said,

"Did anyone on the news mention that the democrats had slipped in a provisions where 20% of the money would go straight into a government housing program"

<br>

That is not true exactly. The proposal was for 20% of any profits from this bailout go to a fund to keep people, at the lower end of the economic scale, in their homes.

<br>

BTW: McCain did nothing to help the negociations. They were going well before his misguided trip to Washington and they went back on tract when he left. McCain knows nothing about finance, by his own admission. he is not a negociater nor is he on the relevant committees. The only thing McCain helped was his irratic campaign.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

macflix — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:12:54 GMT

At one point Obama said hed declare war on Pakistan... why did he get drawn into that?

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

hitobito — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:34:04 GMT

McCain was showing his advanced age as the debate progressed. He looked like a wizen old man. He keep speaking about the past and could not deny his tax breaks for the super rich and energy companies. His ideas for dealing with our enemies were archaic and may get us into another war without an end. I like the idea of going after the muslims who attacked us. But to keep fighting a war based on faulty intelligence against a country that had absolutely nothing to do with the 9/11 attacks on our country is foolhardy. Our military "surge" patrolled the streets of Baghdad while the Iraqi parliament took a summer break. We are paying all of the expenses for a war that Bush and McCain said would be paid from Iraqi oil revenues. This has not happened. McCain is essentially an extension of Bush's third term. We cannot afford another four years of Bush/McCain failed policies!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:54:09 GMT

"To deliver the knock out punch in the first debate would not be agood approach for Obama."

Obama needs everyone to "knock out" someone. McCain stands on his own two feet and needs only himself yet is open enough to consider the opposite or opposing side. A person who needs everyone cannot knock out anyone. Obama found this out already from the combat he did with Hillary Clinton. Obama couldnt knock Clinton out he had to appease her.

"When exactly was nuclear Pakistan as failed state? How many points did McCain get for that invention?"

When Pakistan started to fire upon our troops for making unilaterial moves. Oddly enough moves Obama would make without Pakistan on board. e.g. the same complaint Obama complains about Bush and Iraq. Obama is a hypocrite.

"He simply dances around the issues and takes whatever position appears to be more appealing to his audience."

Obama did this in San Francisco and dissed on white collar workers at a "closed" fundraiser. Obama often does this...

"One incredible miss by MCCain was he went to Washington to shake up the 700billiion dollar taxpayer bloodbath and he succeeded yet he didn't take any credit he merely said he sided with the house republicans."

Humility. Just humbleness.

"Did anyone on the news mention that the democrats had slipped in a provisions where 20% of the money would go straight into a government housing program. That would of permanently grown government by 140 billion dollars and no one reported it!!!"

IF Obama and the other democrates would have their way the government would bail out all of the foreclosed houses..no matter the majority of those people wouldnt of qualified in the first place or perhaps lied about their income on their "income stated" applications. Yet, we the taxpayers have to pay for this.....

"In the Old West, the original definition of a "maverick" was a little calf that had lost its' mother, or had become separated from its' mother. So, I guess John is a REAL MAVERICK."

Main Entry: 1mav·er·ick

Pronunciation: \ˈmav-rik, ˈma-və-\

Function: noun

Etymology: Samuel A. Maverick †1870 American pioneer who did not brand his calves

Date: 1867

1: an unbranded range animal ; especially : a motherless calf

2: AN INDEPENDENT INDIVIDUAL WHO DOES NOT GO ALONG WITH A GROUP OR PARTY

Your comment is an Ad hominem.

"clearly speaking OBAMA WON, AMERICA NEEDS A PRESIDENT WHO IS INTELLIGENT NOT A FIGHTER . "

Tell this to Al Qaeda. Then again the best fighters are quite intelligent and know when to fight and when not to.

"HE DID BEHAVED LIKE A TOTAL IDOIT, HE WAS MAKING A FOOL OF HIMSELVE WITH A TALKING POINT. "

Obama had his own talking points but failed to really get them out. McCain controled the debate (this was also mentioned in a newsweek article.)

"Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama sought to score a quick post-debate advantage Saturday by traveling to two Republican-leaning states and accusing GOP rival John McCain of being out of touch with middle-class Americans."

This is why he went to Washington to make sure that 700 billion wouldnt get to screwy.. The middle class is going to get to pay AGAIN because Fannie Mae and Mac along with other regularators didnt do their job. (by the way those regs were loosened by Democrates so people could get housing easier...so dont go there).

"McCain SPANKED Obama and did it with class."

Obama surely was agreeing with McCain A LOT and was on the defensive most of the time.

" Obama as the new, more viable, more focused on the here and now and better to lead us in these new challanges? I did. "

The here and now depends on what audience Obama is speaking to. I think Obama is a worse flip floper than Sen. Kerry.

"Obama scared me with his talk of invading Paksistan. Is he an idiot?? "

Needless to say we wouldnt have to go to War with Pakistan. Obama as President who would ignore or exclude Parkistan in the search and elimination of Pakistan would cause them to be pissed. Pakistan is already shooting at our own troops for doing things on their own. HINT HINT. Pakistan could easily go rouge and be like Iran BUT WITH NUKES. Pakistan would have the capability to send a nuke in a suit case and take out a city here. DUH. UTTER LACK OF JUDGMENT AND EXPERIENCE ON OBAMA'S PART. This is not to mention foresight.

"McCain supporters, please explain -- right now -- why continuing to bleed the nation's coffers, military posture and flexibility, and credibility in Iraq is preferable to bleeding them in Afghanistan. Same rules of legitimacy apply."

Iraq and Afganistan are connected. Yes, the Iraq war was mishandled but we are there, and to just merely withdrawl would show us to be weak in the eyes of the Arab world and would emboded the bad guys. Further, yes Al Qaeda is now in Iraq where they were not before. However, when we engage them we gain Intel and Kill them.

~This is used both in Iraq and Afganistan. Better to have the enemy drawn over there and busy over there than HERE. OR would the people enjoy the battle ground to be in the U.S.?

"To me , winning the debate means that you have successfully responded to your challenger's charrges. Obama did that time and time again - and he did it with the calm efficient manner of someone who knows and believes in what he is saying."

Yes Obama responded but what did he say? Bush Bush Bush. McCain IS NOT Bush. McCain has taken issue with policies of Bush before as with Obama.

From the Wall Street Journal:

"No Vote for the Troops"

"Even Barack Obama, who opposed the Iraq troop surge, has finally acknowledged its success. But some of his fellow Democrats in Congress apparently remain unconvinced. Earlier this week, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid and Armed Services Chairman Carl Levin teamed up to block a vote on a bipartisan resolution "recognizing the strategic success of the troop surge in Iraq" and thanking our men and women in uniform for their efforts."

Again no Judgment No Experience ....on the part of Obama however there is Damage Control.

"I only hope the American people can see through the nosnsense of McCain and his team."

Perhaps Obama shouldnt be a flip flopper then I wouldnt be opposed to him. He lacks actual substance but what does come out of his mouth does sound good.

"Sen. Obama is charm personified. Luckily, he also has superior intellect and judgment. No need for Sen. Obama to resort to butchery when he has the skill of a surgeon."

No Obama speaks well, but he hasnt had an original idea yet........

"The copycat media and loud mouthed pundits stepped up their attacks on Obama and Michelle."

Stop whinning since the Press does this to republicans more so.......

"I could not agree more. I watched the debate with my local pro-Obama group and we all agreed that although more or less even, McCain had him "on points". I'm a boxer myself so I also think using these these metaphors."

Well that's honesty for ya...

"What I found frustrating was Obama's refusal to take McCain to task, and that is why originally I supported Hillary and not him."

There is very little Obama can take McCain to task. McCain's record is public and in full view of the light unlike the flip flopping of Obama. e.g. Offshore Drilling, Energy Bill he bashes bush over with, .....

"We are ignoring the fact that this man, as admirable as he is, has no proven track record on the economy, he never served in the military and he has no foreign policy experience. We have a very complicated world and Obama is just not ready when it comes to taking the controls. "

Obama doesnt have a track record at all..well he is making one as a flip flopper. e.g. speaking down to the middle class white collared worker while here in San Francisco.......then hugging and kissing the middle class as they give him money to be president. Shame on "us" not Obama I think..

"I see the GOP spin team is out in force again today, madly blazing away in the basement of the Karl Rove building. They start 'em young over there, in the typing pool. This makes them more effective as future lobbists."

You mean people who like McCain are not allowed to voice it? How typical of a left wing person who would profess to want people's rights adhered to yet would attempt to surpress them because someone disagrees with you. Is this not a play out of the book that you are boasting about?

"Senator Obama's KO punch comes on November 4th...WE THE PEOPLE are the final punch to his lead..."

No the Electoral College is not you nor I....

"-- Lehrer gave Obama an open invitation to link the economic problems to national security, but he didn't emphasize that idea -- that real national military security MUST be founded on economic security and broad prosperity"

..because to do so would of been incorrect... factually incorrect. The U.S. can out produce any country if we really want to. We feed the world-litterally.

Maybe Obama should stand on his own merit and experience and not advisors all the time. Oh wait.. Obama cant because he doesnt have that experience thus not the judgment.

TBH

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:55:58 GMT

P.S.

"Under General David Petraeus, who relinquished command of U.S. forces in Iraq on Tuesday, sectarian bloodshed has almost entirely abated, daily attacks have fallen to 25 from a high of 180 in June 2007, and overall violence has declined by more than 70%. In July, U.S. combat deaths were lower than in any month since the beginning of the war. All of the troops sent to Iraq as part of the surge have now returned home and are not being replaced."

-Wall Street Journal

"No Vote for the Troops"

SEPTEMBER 20, 2008

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:58:59 GMT

SEPTEMBER 20, 2008

No Vote for the Troops

Wall Street Journal

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 02:00:14 GMT

-Wall Street Journal

"No Vote for the Troops"

SEPTEMBER 20, 2008

"Joe Biden introduced a resolution opposing the surge. And Hillary Clinton said the reports of progress in Iraq required "a willing suspension of disbelief."

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

greymase — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 02:10:55 GMT

"Ali is shouting, exulting in his conquest." Maybe I am wrong, but I believe Ali was yelling at Liston to get up and give his best in the fight, and not just to lay down after being in the ring long enough to claim the minimal match purse for the loser. I actually feel that way as a Democrat facing Obama. We've developed an Ali-level fighting strength and network, and Obama seems to want to lay there and not put on the best fight possible. Was winning the primary enough for him? Perhaps he dislikes the fighting metaphor as much as he clearly disliked the notion of actually landing a verbal punch against McCain. I don't want it as mere spectacle, but we have to win. The Republicans will do whatever is necessary, and we can't afford any more philospohical differences with the system we're faced with (Nader may have been right about a few things, but that fool helped only Bush, who has turned out to be catastrophically bad at governing this nation).

Why, when McCain had the temerity to suggest that Obama was a recent convert to earmark opposition, did Obama not mention McCain and the Keating 5? McCain was a convert to ethics, and would never have co-sponsored the campaign finance bill had he not been caught with his short fingered hand in the cookie jar. Or taken the softball of the bear genetic study to point out that McCain had picked a running mate who had signed off on earmark requests to study harbor seal genes? There were countless other easy openings provided by McCain, and Obama refused to take them, or was afraid to do so.

I don't want a hot head, but I want Obama to fight for me starting NOW, not when he is perhaps elected to the White House because people dislike him less than McCain/Palin. These people deserve to have their records and ideas pilloried - respectfully, but inexorably.

Sorry for the long post - I usually hate long posts!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

gkragland — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 04:59:46 GMT

Nice Try Howard; I am not going to fall for your poorly disguised attempt to "knock" Obama. It is clear from your reference to your colleagues...ughm all of Newsweek that you want Obama to win. Please, stop pretending you are an objective journalist. You, Alter, Zakaria are such transparent liberals it's embarrassing for Newsweek and MSNBC when you pretend to be objective. Here is the knock out punch. You are irrelevant. I am one of the few people who even bothers to comment on your bias driblle. Most other Americans tune you out. Nice wig; you should recommend the same wig dresser for Alter; he looked better with that rat fur on his head. Zakaria...is he supposed to be a journalist or was he hired by someone in the Middle East to propagate this Anti-America treason...seriously, take this BS and shove it. Don't try to shovel it our way...we see right through you.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Dragonqueen — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 05:54:16 GMT

Gkragland, please get over yourself. Calling people names and attacking their looks is childish and unproductive. If you want to accuse someone of the "sin" of liberalism, feel free to do so, but your rant is just --- ridiculous. Please.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

jrs18 — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 06:32:03 GMT

I think you are quite on point Howard. There are strategic and I think personal reasons he doesnt attempt to knock out his opponent. Id also suggest to follow your boxing analogy that he inflicted many blows leaving Senator McCain standing but looking beaten.

On the economy his key point was I will lower taxes for 95% of working families and raise them for the richest corporations and individuals. He pointed out that although earmarks are bad (and should be eliminated) they account for 18 Billion significant less than the 300 Billion from the Bush/McCain tax cuts.

On the war he was clear that Senator McCain was wrong numerous times and that we took our eye off Afghanistan where the terrorists came from.

I think these are the most important points to get out there and they were loud and clear. He also showed the spirit of bipartisanship by not disagreeing with everything and pointing out that Senator McCain is right on some things (earmarks etc). Indeed he has even given President Bush credit for his work on AIDs in Africa.

It seems to me that these are things Americans want to see. He also showed command of the issues and every commentator has pointed this out in what was supposed to be a weakness.

For Sarah those are the reasons that I think Senator Obama won the debate. One other reason was that Senator McCain was a little too aggressive in my view. He refused to look at Senator Obama, he continued to push and attack even when his time was past. Senator Obama may not have hit back as he could have when Senator McCain misspoke on Pakistan among other things but he respected the rules. If he had chosen not to he risks being seen as the angry black man (part of the strategy I would guess). The interruptions by the way were when Senator just misspoke or plain distorted (I was kind and didnt say lie) about Senator Obama's positions.

Speaking of misinterpreting he didnt say he would go to war with Pakistan. He said if we have a high target value in our sights and the Pakistan government will not or cannot help then we do not need to ask permission.

To Walter the former Democrat who likens Obama ot Bush I would suggest you are missing the point. Senator Obama has a different tax policy (more relief for the middle class) than either Senator McCain or President Bush. He is for regulation of the financial market vs against for either McCain or Bush (which led to the latest meltdown and crisis).

Senator Obama has also shown the judgement in my view at least on Iraq and Afghanistan that neither Senator McCain or President Bush have used. Experience only helps if you have the judgement to back it up. Im sad to say that Senator McCain was wrong on Iraq, was wrong to ignore Afghanistan, was wrong to support deregulation, and Id add is wrong on his running mate. He is right on earmarks and the need to change what has been going on the past 8 years. The problem is that he has been behind most of those economic policies including tax breaks for the wealthy at the expense of the middle class of the Bush presidency.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

bakkakkaw — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 09:23:03 GMT

being well articulated, from my opinion, Obama won the debate by a little bid of points , may be 2 or 1!

He was well more precised through his statements. He also acted on stage more presidential than McCain did. The way I do conceive McCain's prestation and attitude, it's like he wanted a real fight with Obama, what I don't think that the public did appreciate.

However, Obama should have scored a lot if he was a real Ali.

Senator was forced to accept the debate, when American people wanted to know what was going on in Washington. Rick Davis was still getting paid while doing nothing(Fannie-Freddie)

We are all Georgians. the republican party was upset for not going to the protest against Iran which is not a real third country world. The future CEO of the greates country on earth was going to protest against Iran's president! wow! .

Iraq war costs USA 1000% time more than Afghanistan where are hidden the real responsible of 9/11.

Prasing Mushara and all of sudden dropping him off the board looks like McCain's habit Gambling who within a short period of time has chosen his running mate without thinking the grave consequences that that might posefor his campaign.

I think that if Obama elaborated and detailed all of that before the audience, he would have been almost over for McCain. So, I agree that Obama is not a real ALI.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

killroy6 — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 11:49:28 GMT

What a surprise! Another in the tank, drank the Kool-Aid media exhalting the might O'bammy..........Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah,Blah,Blah, Blah! Nobody cares that you get a tingly feeling all up and down your leg. McCain won the debate hands down and you have to spin it because you are in his back pocket. O'bammy is a *** boy and I think McCain could take him right now with a swift kick to those huge ear flaps. McCain/Palin '08.......get used to it. It's a done deal.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sadistic sally mae — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 12:20:43 GMT

Howard,

If this was a heavyweight fight I would have agreed with your analogy. Since it was a political debate, I do not see the connection. Ali never ran for office but he was political. But Obama did look Presidential, showed his great intelligence and was unafraid to look McCain in the eyes and call him a liar. Now that I think of it, maybe the analogy was appropriate, Ali would have done the same!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

sadistic sally mae — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 12:44:01 GMT

Howard

If you really want a story, go find out how those 5 US Naval Academy cadets who ranked behind McCain made out in life? Then compare it to those graduates who were ranked behind Obama (Honor student) at Columbia. Now that would be an interesting story I would like to read about.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 15:43:35 GMT

"No Vote for the Troops - John McCain has voted against 430million fo r vets...Judgmant?"

Whart was attached to that Bill. Did you figure that out? How many riders did it have that had nothing to do with funding for vets? Did you mention this? No.

The same goes with the GI bill. Which by the way the new one would of caused a massive exit of personel from service because it liberalized the service requirements. Give the full story eh?

"Senator Obama has also shown the judgement in my view at least on Iraq and Afghanistan that neither Senator McCain or President Bush have used."

Biden voted for the Iraq War along side McCain. Biden relied on the same information the everyone else relied on including Bush. However, since Obama at the time of this was not in the U.S. Senate he did not have access to the entire story and was playing arm chair quarterback then rejected the go to War.

Needless to say this is the pattern of Obama. He makes decisions without the entire story. Obama has not been to Afganistan NOT ONCE yet. Obama only went ot Iraq after the prodding of McCain.

Get the facts straight.......

TBH

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

faceoctober — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 17:08:56 GMT

I respectfully disagree with the writers view of the debate. McCain would'nt even look at Obama giving off a sense of fear in my view. Like when you lie and dont want to look the person in the eye. For those of you who think Obama had a coach it was very clear he was motioning to the moderator for his help to let him talk. DUH!!! People are to cynical. Anyways McCain faired ok, but Obama in my eyes was indeed the winner on both Economy and foreign policy.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

stephen50 — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 17:21:08 GMT

What is the goal in politics at any level? Reelection. How do you accomplish this? Take polls and create sound bites. Doing this effectively wins elections. May the best sound bite win!

Our government is run by politicians whose main goal is reelection. Our founding fathers were statesmen who actually cared more about what was right for the nation. Their goal was to unravel the big picture and do what was best for the nation - not what was best for reelection. Obama has toed the party line and created good sound bites. McCain has looked at the big picture and fought his party to do what is best for the nation. McCain is the closest thing to a statesman in government that I have seen.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Sam10 — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 19:49:29 GMT

I do not understand where or how it was brought about to pick Obama from the Democratic group of litter running for president. About the only thing going for him is that he is rather young and black. No foreign policy experience, not an economic type, not fluid on any tangible information to help the country. So why pick him? Hillary was the best all around choice, Joe Biden has the experience, Dodd has plenty of economic savvy ( he and Barney Frank have been stealing from America for a while now). So why Obama. Does the DNC actually think America will not fight to prevent this dangerous and very inexperienced, friend to terrorists. How odd that he has no one to take for him from the years he spent with Ayers, Wright, Rezko and Phleger. How is it for him to brush aside those years and no responible media follows up with actually digging up this story. IT MAY BE A BAD THING IF OBAMA LOSES, BUT IT WILL BE DANGEROUS IF HE WINS.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

cely99 — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 20:05:20 GMT

I don't understand either.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

newsweekthisweek — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 01:11:00 GMT

First, I would also like to take a moment to brag that I know Mohammed Ali. In fact, not only did I shake hands with him and took pictures, I served him breakfast in my uncle's restaurant in Sherbrooke, Quebec, Canada, in the very early 1960's. (I was in my teens during my school summer break) in one of his fights with the then Sonny Liston, for the World Heavyweight Championship Title in the Sherbrooke Arena, which he won. I can still remember him screaming: "I Am The Greatest!!!", which heralded the front page of the Sherbrooke Daily Record at the time. On the morning of the fight, he had 3 eggs over-easy; bacon; a humongous rare T-bone steak; cheese; 3 toast; orange juice; milk and coffee, I remember as if it was yesterday. Bear in mind, during their bout at the fight, they lose between 10 to 15 pounds on that day alone. This was right at the time that he changed religions and name, from Casius Clay to Mohammed Ali. I used to make stunning speeches about boxing where many people questioned why a young female teenager would even contemplate such issues; however, this specific issue is not about a boxing match. Enough of that.

Now, frankly, unlike all other past and present Presidents of the United States of America, I would like to claim that Barack Obama is what you refer to as "change". By that I mean, we are all very tired of all the gimmicks; the lies; the games, the aggressive behaviours and bashings of one another and corruptive games. This is the common world in combination with its allies; its enemies; and all that's in between. This is the war and the killings of innocent people; about people starving to death; this is about wrong decisions at the wrong times; this is now what we call the danger zone, there's little sanity left. I can't name it other than that. Period.

IT IS TIME FOR A CHANGE.

A change in attitude; a change in approach; a change in the way issues are handled in the White House and all that bad vibe stuff.

Obama is the one for that. He knows exactly how to handle himself and be effective as a gentleman and as a leader of a nation. Believe me, he's had numerous numbers of times when he could have been a creep, but he is above and beyond the level of ignorance and stupidity. He has far too much know-how in his impeccable communication skills and sensitivity of how to posture himself at any given time. He has worked his temper to create the vision of what he eventually would become - President of the United States of America. It has not been an easy feat for him.

His every step has been envisioned and played out in reality and this is where he is now. Having said that, this behaviour can, at times, be a detriment to his demeanor, but, he is presentable and knows when to jab, although not as much as I or others would like.

He has a way of measuring his stance and his response at any given moment. He is a visionary who clearly works his path through the rough and tough and tumbles with the tide, simply because he sees where his attitude will take him. He is a very focussed and passionate person who knows where he is going: he sees the outcome far above the rest, believe me, I have been closely studying him and at times I want to scream but I deeply sense the reasoning behind his actions.

He takes his time before he jabs in the ribcage of a person, not because he would not want to.

He is not one to react with uncalculated emotion like McLame, who jumps from one corner to the next like a caged animal. McLame is seriously brain-damaged from his POW experience, it's sad to say, and he has carried this "maverick" attitude throughout his dealings where-ever he goes. On a personal level, I have difficulty seeing him as a maverick, there's nothing "maverickish" about him, if even such a word exists; I see a lot of bullyishness which is so unpresidential and distasteful to the nation, never mind to the rest of the world who is also watching. Remember, this man has to deal with world problems and world leaders; he refuses to meet with dignitaries he does not like and those who think differently from him. Now, what kind of a president would want to think and act like him, at the same time expect success on issues of great means and values to the world at large? Will that create another war that we just simply cannot afford...? Give me a break..!

Barack Obama is steady and calm in the harshest of climates - it is his way of seeing the light of all tunnels - steady; and sure, he will get there.

It is time for heart to step in the White House - it is time to be mindful in mannerisms - it is where we need to be - at this stage of life - the world is in such turbulence - it is a scary place - one cannot just jump at every occasion he gets when he knows well enough what lied behind us and what lies ahead of us - we must tread lightly on the ground of negotiations - more so than ever before in our lifetime - mainly because it is the only way out of this deathrap in which we have presently engaged ourselves. Never has life been so complicated; never have costs risen to this unproportionate level; never has life been as demanding, with increased suffering and total unrest worldwide... to mention but a few.

It is time for a change...

Believe me, we must treat this world with love with a capital "L". It is the only way we'll get anywhere.

I don't intend to be wishy-washy, but we've proven that cruelty brings on additional cruelty. It goes far beyond understanding and acceptance. It is imperative to contribute sensitivity values: it is time to partner and embrace the world - we've gone against it long enough, thank you very much. Every single vibration has a huge impact on this universe as well as its surroundings. Give Life Love And Give It A Chance. Change it is. With Barack Obama.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

martimr1 — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 01:50:27 GMT

Howard, I, too, was frustrated that Obama declined the many opportunities he had Friday night to reduce McCain to paste. I kept waiting for the crushing torrent of facts that I know were pent up in Obama's substantial mind.

But, looking at the debate results that mattered - the reactions of the undecided - I decided perhaps that Obama was wise. He smilingly waved off the right to rebut McCain's most ridiculuous distortion of the evening. Apparently, the electorate got it. Maybe it wouldn't have looked good for that strong, brilliant man in his prime to wipe the floor with the weakened and panicky old guy. So he didn't.

Perhaps this is proof of what we have long believed: that diplomacy is the way to win.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

garnetgal11 — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 03:55:58 GMT

I think it is ridiculous to compare a presidential debate with a prize fight. We have had enough of the sneering, mockery of the Republican convention and their lying ads. We want and yearn for someone we can look up to, someone intelligent, cares about the middle class workers and their homes, jobs, health care, education and ending our addiction for foriegn oil. Obama is that man, he will give us HOPE and confidance in our govt and country. He will try to be honest in his dealings with the Anerican public and not lead us into an unneccary war, with as many as 5000 dead and over 30,000 wounded, He will make America proud and regain our prestige around the world, this world we all live in is too small to have so many enemies, we need to lead by example and show the world what a true democracy can be. Obama is the man to do this. Garnetgal2

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

garnetgal11 — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 03:55:59 GMT

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Sam10 — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 04:24:26 GMT

Listen, if this was all for a game of checkers, then let Obama win. But this is the most important decision we make for the future. Having Obama running for president is dangerous enough, he has a 50% chance of actually being America's leader (scary thought). The zealots praising this man, screaming their heads off suddenly go blank when asked to name something that he has actually written into law ( nothing, period). There seem to be no endless amount of excuses and charges of racism when pushed to answer anything relative to painting a history of Obama. When John McCain becomes president I will breathe a sigh of releif, and maybe, just maybe we will have the media actually write something truthful aobut Obama.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

poohgirl65 — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 06:34:41 GMT

If this were any other election these thoughts of experience, what has been written into law, age, and comparing their accomplishments to Bush might have mattered. The fact is this is not like any other election. Bush talked about "This sucker is going down" and who does he think did that to us. What it really boils down to is we have some one that will give us more of what we have had for the last 7 1/2 years or someone who could change things. It is not about democratic or republican, it is about common sense. The last thing we need is more of what we have and Obama can't possible do any worse. I think we should all, all across The United States, write in Hillary Clinton. Let’s face it, if Obama had chose her as his running mate, there would be no chance for McCain. So let the people that wanted her, write her in and get someone else in. If that is not plausible then anyone, anytime, anywhere is better than a Bush want-to-be. Last election people were afraid to vote for Carey because we were in the middle of a war. So this mess Bush got us in was a good reason to vote him in a second time? That is ridiculous. Now look what we have, our economy is worse than it has been in a very, very long time.

As I drive through our city I notice that in the wealthier neighborhoods the signs are for McCain and the middle to lower income neighborhoods have signs for Obama. Maybe that is due to the fact McCain is like Bush and wants more for those that already have more and less for the ones working hard everyday to survive. Do we really want or need more of Bush for the next four years? Well, if we don’t then what other choice do we have? If you are someone who doesn’t like Obama or you are looking at the candidates age, color, or religion, then ask yourself not “Do I like Obama”, but “Do we want more Bush”. That should make the decision pretty simple.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

florencevales — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 12:13:11 GMT

In my humble opinion, Senator John McCain came across as speaking from his heart. Obama seemed scripted but in the long run who is it that we can trust that truly loves America and has worked for it over the years.

Florence Vales

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

spirit — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 13:37:31 GMT

McCain was making faces as Obama spoke. Obama was composed as McCain spoke. I didn;'t notice it at first becasue the channel I was watching did not show a split screen all the time. When I saw it again on CSPAN, it was obvious Mc Cain was laughing and smirking a bit too much. I like what Biden said over the weekned too. He was at those countries also and just becasue he was there did not make him right about it. I liked McCain in 2000, but now he looks too old and too out of touch.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Not4BO — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 13:52:13 GMT

Obama was very well rehearsed for the debate and that's exactly how he came across to me. McCain sounded much more caring and engaged. It's sad that people are being so fooled by this person who is being bought and paid for by big Democratic dollars. I also don't believe that McCain is like getting four more years of Bush. Bush had no experience when he came into the White House, he picked a 'seasoned vice president," and look where it got us. Obama has no experience, hasn't accomplished one significant thing in his years as a state or national senator, and he's pciked a typical Washington seasoned politician as his VP. What we don't need is a well-spoken inexperienced person to lead us thorugh this mess we're in - we need experience and someone who will cross party lines to get the work done - Bush would never do that - Obama has never done that - McCain has done it many times.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

tjc33_7 — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 15:59:51 GMT

Neither stated things we wanted to hear. But, McCain sound like a military man. Nothing wrong with that, but I think we need to look at other ways to influence people in the nation. I believe there are some drawbacks to both candidates, so I am voting for the lesser of the two evils. Sorry McCain, you seem like a corporate puppet with your plans you are promoting.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

tschiele23 — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 16:22:35 GMT

I am not a DEM or REP in the modern terms. I can not justifiably call myself a critical free thinker and vote for someone solely because of a political affiliation. Isn't that to a sense limiting your own ability to freely rationalize life?

I saw the debate and I can see why a writer could compare it to Ali or a boxing match. It was clear that McCain was more aggressive and it was clear that Obama was more relaxed and passive. I would rather talk about the issues though.

McCain had no response for when Obama called him out on tax loop holes and on giving big tax breaks to Corporations and no relief to the middle class. Whether Republican or Democrat I need you guys to look deeper. McCain's only Response to our problems is stopping Eamarks which is not a big problem unless abused and Free Enterprise. (How is this helpful to the struggling middle class or the Lower Level Americans who have never been given a chance with education, life, living or advancing?) How do you look at McCain and say he is intouch with what we the STRUGGLING AMERICANS are facing?

Truth be told in my personal opinion I would love for Obama to be more aggressive but that is just my personal opinion and may not be what is best for Aemerica now. I honestly went into this election not decided but as I saw a 72 year old McCain make as many changes as he has on so many issues I saw a man desperate to win after failingof at two attempts to be president. I also Liked Hillary and Bill Clinton, I liked Joe Biden, I liked Former mayor New York Guiliianni but after all the dust settles and we head into the final days there are only two candidates left. In a comparison I like McCain as a senator and Obama as a senator but when I place them side by side to be a President I can not see myself voting for a man like McCain to be the New face of America. He is the (Old) face of America in my opinion.

his stance on Iraq is a foolish one. Just because the surge worked doesn't mean it wasn't a foolish war to start, I am in the Army so I will tell you fellow Americans the truth. When Bush asked to go to war with Iraq the U.N. vastly disagreed and told him not to in the name of international importance. They (U.N.) said they would support strikes into Afghanistan because it was initially harboring the terrorist cells responsible for 911 but any attacks on Iraq would not be supported. Bush went on National TV and told America that we are the greatest nation on Earth and we do not need approval to go to war against terror . he said that Saddam was linked to Bin Laden and that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. So we as America looked him in his lying eyes and accepted this as John McCain supported this attack on Iraq. As we attacked Iraq we only strengthen terror because many misguided young men joined the terrorist cells because they did not want America forcing itself on borders without reason. As we continued to attack Iraq more misguided lost young middle easterners joined in the fight against us. Not because they hate America but because they hated what America stood for going against all conventional wisdom attacking Iraq for no reason other than Bush wanted revenge on Saddam because Saddam tried to kill his father when he was president. (John McCain supported this hateful action)

As we lost most of our Alliances in the U.N. and Bush failed policies became a reality to the average person too blind to see they voted for this man, we saw many people jump off of the ban wagon. Many acted as if they never supported the dictator known as Bush but at least McCain stayed true to show his Alliance to the dictator. He supports the Patriot Act which supports spying on everybody in America for no reason through technology or whatever means available . He supported a failed war that had nothing to do with 911. he supported giving little help to the people that really needed it like victims of Katrina. He supported the lies and the illegally way Bush even won by his brother , the Governor or Florida tampering with the votes of Florida.

I finally say again that I am not a democrat or republican but I am just a simple man that gets up for work everyday just like you. I am a regular man with bills, problems and struggles, just like you. And when I look at the problem, the problem is simple. Many of you know McCain is not the right choice to fix foreign and domestic struggles but you chose not to vote for Obama simply because he is not the traditional White Man . Be Honest of your real fears. Obama symbolizes more and stands for more. Put down your DEM r or REP hat and look at he issues. Maybe like Ali Obama has to fight racism in the form or the everyday person that is afraid of CHANGE. We should support a person based on his ability to bring inspiration and hope, McCain provides no inspiration other than the story of being a prisoner of war. This race would not even be this close if Obama was a white man with the same characteristics.

Look at you wallet and bank account and ask yourself will it be any better with McCain or will you be saying after four years that you should not have voted for McCain just like you are doing now with Bush

COPY AND PASTE THIS YOUTUBE VIDEO TO LISTEN

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re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

areba — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 19:07:05 GMT

Howard

The metaphor would have been absolutely perfect if you labelled It as 'Ali's boxing' not just boxing. There's no comparison between Ali's way and the traditional boxing routines.

Now let's focus on the debate between the two competing leaders of the greatest economy that's on the verge of a major collapse. One point has to be recognised, McCain used the same old 'exploitation principle', namely, the 'Forest Gump' approach to arouse the emotions of the Americans who have over a very long period of time been recognised as individuals who are 'high on emotion, low on logic'. This is no longer the case. Americans may be forgiving but not naive, at least, I'd be inclined to believe so. Clearly, McCain concentrated on the theme of 'finish off the job or be labelled as losers' and made repetitive and truly annoying attempts to relate other issues to it exactly the way Bush or Cheney or Rumsfeld has done it so irrationally yet consistently. This is not anything new.

McCain cannot offer anything new. Indeed, the US itself has run out of its offerings it has provided to the rest world for such a considerable period of time. Thus, I have a little bit of 'cognitive dissonance' as to whether and how Obama can make a difference. Nevertheless, I can beyond a shadow of a doubt, claim that Obama is sincere, truly committed and has a much higher degree of integrity. He'd make a superior leader, no question about that. In fact, he may, due to his understanding of many different peoples and their behavioural patterns, initiate and lead a more realistic and sustainable relationship between the US and most of the other countries. He, I'd imagine, would create an atmosphere of change that's founded upon mutual benefits rather than the domination based on the practice of 'absolute control'. Thus, although I have my doubts, I can have a sigh of relief knowing fully well that there's going to be a US President who, unlike most others, is means what he says.

You don't need an experienced president to run the US since US presidents rarely, actively participate in whole decision making process. Even the final decision taken by him is passed over to him by the chosen one(s). Obama is a hugely intelligent person and can conceptualise complex issues based on their interrelationships, a crucial attribute that McCain lacks. Why wouldn't he? He works on the basis of pre-determined frameworks. This might explain why he was frequently questioning Obama's grasp of a range of basic concepts that don't warrant extensive knowledge. For instance, at one point he made a remark in respect of whether Obama understood the distinction between strategy and tactic. This type of questioning not only raises doubt if McCain himself is in the process of enhancing or even building his conceptual rigour but also undermines his focus, if any, on significant practical issues.

I'm sure most of you have seen McCain's reactions in different modes, particularly, his rather weird facial expression with the 'boy doesn't know anything' attitude. He was adopting different styles, mostly irritating and clealry, pre-meditated to intimidate Obama. Considering that McCain resorted to the strategy (or tactic???) of intimidating Obama in ways that, indeed, turned out to be rather silly, I must say Obama's response was impeccably thought out and presented.

McCain says that the soldiers in Iraq want to 'win' so that their children don't have to come back to finish it off. This is the only excuse he could suggest to justify the US military presence, possibly through permanent bases, in Iraq. May I ask, Senator, who are your army trying to fend off at the moment? What are your success criteria? If you wanted to bomb an entire nation back to the stone age, you have succeeded, no doubt. If the target recipients of your 'shock and awe' strategy were the Americans, it has been a hugely effective strategy. May I further ask 'how can you even imagine giving security guarantee to the people in Iraq whilst you cannot ensure security against terrorist attacks in your own backyard?' Obama has been immensely brave, I can understand that well. He has been absolutely forthright and honest, of course, or else he would have tried to use the same old cheap ploy of 'raising the terror level to 10 (if there's any)' and presented to the voting public the predicament of choosing the better war leader, as if the US were constantly at war.

The US are not at war with anyone. There's a price that it has to pay for becoming the greatest economy in the world. The attacks on the Americans are carried out by a bunch of lunatics and cannot be justified under any circumstances. These people do not belong to Islam, that's a certainty. An Islamic name or a beard or a cap on top of your head doesn't grant you access to the 'religion of peace', there are many other criteria that you must fulfill to claim that you are a muslim. One such criterion is not to harm anyone or anything, not even an insect. It may sound surprising that causing the slightest inconvenience or discomfort to others deliberately is a sin in Islam.

The US and its people are liked and even loved by the greatest majority of muslims the world over. Muslims only have reservations with regards to certain US foreign policies. Then again there are millions of people of other religions who share the same point of view. This propaganda that the US are at war with the muslims is a source of success for three groups: 1. the terrorists (not the muslims); 2. the neocons (not the true christains); and 3. the zionists (not the jews). Whether or not we can classify John McCain as one of the above, we know with certainty that he'd set America on fire to establish that it is at war (a downright falsehood) and that he'd be a better war-leader.

One doesn't have to be very intelligent to feel completely at ease with the fact that Obama is determined to take the US to a new, superior and sustainable height. He has all that it takes to do just that, but he needs the big-hearted Americans by him.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 23:17:11 GMT

.......

Go here:

www.youtube.com/user/TheMouthPeace

Play the following videos:

"Burning Down The House: What Caused Our Economic Crisis? V2 "

and

"Covering Your Fannie, Who Really Caused Our Economic Crisis?"

These videos speak to for themselves.

The democrates are guilty in starting this sub-prime mortgage mess.

WHY DOESN'T NEWSWEEK REPORT THIS?????????????????????

McCain tried to stop it and was blocked by the DEMOCRATS

TBH

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

areba — Tue, 30 Sep 2008 14:17:34 GMT

NOT JUST VIDEOS, PROPAGANDA VIDEOS, 'YOU TRUTH BUT HAD IT'? EIGHT YEARS, TWO WARS WITH COMPLETE FOCUS ON WORLD DOMINATION, WHAT DO YOU EXPECT TRUTHBHAD, ECONOMIC PROSPERITY? WELL, THAT WAS THE REPUBLIC'S DREAM ANYWAY: SHOCK AND AWE; CAPTURE AND RULE OVER ALL IRAQI OIL RESOURCES; AND REACH AN INVINCIBLE ECONOMY. HOW VERY CRUEL OF GOD, THAT DIDN'T WORK! ALL YOUR PLANS FAILED AND NOW LOOKING FOR A SCAPEGOAT, AYE? HAVE SOME SENSE OF SHAME, PLEASE!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 07:18:25 GMT

..To bad if you go to the links that are under the url's for the videos... support everything.. .. To bad so sad your pick for pres. is dirty along with his party.

Where is your proof? Areba? Where? You have only general comments against specifics.

TBH

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 07:29:27 GMT

Oh ..... here is more for you Areba...

(my bad) Here is my updated post... have a nice read.

Dont believe me? READ ON and start clicking…..

See what Obama Received in contributions………….. #2 Recipient of Campaign contributions from Fannie…

GO HERE:

FOX NEWS:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGnZMGDG4k4

McCain does not even come close to Obama…NOT EVEN CLOSE…

WHAT CAUSED THIS MESS? THE FINANCIAL CRISIS:

What Caused this Crisis…it was Democratic polices NOT Republicans…:

GO HERE:

http://www.foxnews.com/video2/video08.html?

GO HERE:

http://www.youtube.com/user/TheMouthPeace

http://pl.youtube.com/user/TheMouthPeace

Play the following videos:

“Burning Down The House: What Caused Our Economic Crisis? V3”

and

“Burning Down The House: What Caused Our Economic Crisis? V2”

and

"Covering Your Fannie, Who Really Caused Our Economic Crisis?"

These videos speak to for themselves.

The DEMOCRATS are GUILTY in starting this sub-prime mortgage mess.

WHY ISN'T THE ABOVE BEING REPORTED ?????????????????????

McCain tried to stop it and was blocked by the DEMOCRATS

STILL DON’T BELIEVE?

GO HERE:

http://www.investors.com/editorial/IBDArticles.asp?artsec=16&artnum=1&issue=20080918

then

GO HERE:

http://www.realestatejournal.com/buysell/mortgages/20070420-hagerty.html

then

GO HERE:

http://www.investors.com/editorial/IBDArticles.asp?artsec=16&artnum=1&issue=20080918

then

GO HERE:

http://www.businessandmedia.org/printer/2008/20080924145932.aspx

then

GO HERE:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_Reinvestment_Act

then

GO HERE:

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E06E3D6123BF932A2575AC0A9659C8B63

then

GO HERE:

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C0DE7DB153EF933A0575AC0A96F958260

then

GO HERE:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122247015469280723.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

By the way… 95 voted against the Bail-Out…….

See:

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2008/roll674.xml

…and what proof do you have? Obama’s “good” word?

DO THE RESEARCH !

TBH

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

TruthBhad — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 07:34:07 GMT

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Lasergirl1075 — Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:21:22 GMT

I am unsure whether I loved or hated your article. It is so interesting what you cleverly infer from a print on a wall, that Obama thinks he is Mr. Ali. I have a VanGogh and also a Prince album cover on mine...Believe me I don't think I am in either's league. I wish that I could send your debate tactics to Biden but somehow I think its almost lose/lose. If he trounces Sarah Palin he is a "Big, mean Man" that doesn't like women or families or children. If he is a gentleman, people will feel he is weak even if she gets more than one coherant thought or sentence together. And, by the by... saying "I'll ask John McCain and get back to you" doesn't work in foreign relations.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

areba — Thu, 02 Oct 2008 21:11:16 GMT

Dear TBH

There's no doubt in my mind that you are a very good person at heart and that's where you're being caught up in the 'blue media blender'. The outcome is as invariably expected, a bias against someone who is unique with regards to the position of the US President. It would be same if a female candidate were to become a president.

Please listen, a research must meet a wide range of criteria to be adjudged as a reliable and valid research. One of these criteria is the source of data. These sources are in no way credible and it's a fact that has been demonstrated time and again. TBH it doesn't really matter whether one comes up with specifics and claims them to be reliable/valid. Recall the specifics furnished by the Bush Govt and presented at the UN to convince its members that Iraq had the WMD!!!!! Each of those specifics turned out to be an outright falsehood. I've seen, read and understood all your links; and please note they are not credible, reliable and therefore, not valid to the slightest extent as far as all research quality criteria (both quantitative and qualitative) are concerned.

You don't have to resort to these sources TBH, you know. The Bush administration has damaged the US economy by stretching its internal resources to a level, for the sake of the Iraq war, that it has been concluded by most of your top economists and managers that the US internal resources have been grossly misappropriated. There are data coming out presently that the Afghan war was never at the heart of the neocons' strategy of in respect of the 'new world order', it was just one of the means exploited to attain 'an end', that is, controlling the world's oil wealth. Whereas Bush and his mates adopted the 'Wild West' strategy, Obama is emphasizing on reduction in oil dependence on the Arab countries by 'resource filling' in-country, i.e., the US. What better evidence do you need to claim Obama is patriotic, 100% devoted to the Amrican cause? Would Bush, Cheney, or McCain ever explicitly make a statement of a sort that would annoy some best friends in the Middle East? All they can do is talk tough against Iran or Hezbollah. These people will never carry the risk of upsetting their Arab friends and jeorpardising trillions of dollars of gains they have been guaranteed for decades.

TBH, what did Bush do to ensure the peace of the souls of over three thousand innocent people killed on 11 Sept 2001? Where's Bin Laden, now? Why aren't the American public informed of what has been done so far to hunt down Bin Laden and his associates? Why is he still at large? I'm not an American and I'm white but I know you need a true American (at heart) to lead Americans and I know with certainty that Obama is that true American.

Thanks TBH.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

willnotvoteobama — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 11:38:31 GMT

All eyes on Obama since he is up in the polls! This is great for mccain with 3 weeks before the election! All eyes on Obama means that the skeptics will be picking apart obama's policies and his tax plan! All this focus will let the voters see that under an Obama administration. They will be subject to higher taxes albeit his plan says otherwise but with 3 weeks left the skeptics get to look at it real good and also look at independent reports that debunk the Obama tax plan! Mccain may have played this one just right with one debate left he should be able to pull ahead in the polls before November 4 leaving Obama no time to adjust! FYI; ON OCT 9TH 2004 AL GORE HAD A 12 PT LEAD IN ALL POLLS OVER G.W. BUSH! BUT LOST TO HIM.... ADD THE FACTS THAT ACORN OFFICE GOT RAIDED WE JUST MIGHT HAVE A GAME CHANGER AFTER ALL!

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

cgargiulo — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 05:11:39 GMT

Looks like Obama caught Howard Fineman in his "rope-a-dope." Obama, like Ali, fooled the experts and lured McCain into his trap, remaining cool and presidential at a time of crisis in contrast to McCain's hot-headed rants. He recognized that the American people were not going to fall for the "bluster means strength" baloney that the Republicans pulled in 2004. Every pundit keeps telling Obama that he's doing it all wrong and seem oblivious that his failure to take their advice has led him to beating Clinton and McCain. A more appropriate boxing metaphor would be to compare McCain to Jack Dempsey (not because of skin pigmentation) who lost 19 out of 20 rounds to Gene Tunney but who still has sportswriters (pundits) who keep talking as if Dempsey were the victor.

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Perusing-through — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 03:37:50 GMT

ET TU, HOWARD FINEMAN. ET TU?

Just when I began to accept you as one of the wise and discerning pundits, in a media market crowded with wannabe journalists. How is it that your comrades don't get it?

Senator Obama is truly a 'unique public servant' only because he travels that narrow road of honor, principle, selflessness, humility, and consideration of others; while most other 'politicians' travel so many other paths accept the 'straight & narrow' path. Obama is special because he has managed to intertwine idealism with pragmatism and still CHANGE everything he touches.

My point is that Senator Obama is re-writing American political history and he may be re-writing the book on what the public expects from a 'good public servant'. The political landscape and traditional norms of the past may need to be recalibrated. The tools used by pundits, journalist, and the media for gauging and measuring 'politically related entities' will need to be re-calibrated, or tossed because they are outdated or irrelevant.

If Obama-Biden wins this election, expect the political ramifications to be as deep and as broad, as the "Branch Rickey / Jackie Robinson" experiment. Neither baseball historians nor historians in general, have fully appreciated the impact of that great 1947 baseball experiment that has forever impacted all of America for eternity.

So your first lesson Mr. Howard Fineman, is to stop searching for categories to measure Senator Obama against; like for example Muhammad Ali. Mr. Fineman, you may know Muhammad Ali, but as of today none of us have to the tools to measure the capabilities "This One". Senator Obama just may take Ali's title as the "The Greatest".

re: Sen. Obama, You're No Muhammad Ali

Perusing-through — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 03:47:50 GMT

ET TU, HOWARD FINEMAN. ET TU?

Just when I began to accept you as one of the wise and discerning pundits, in a media market crowded with wannabe journalists. How is it that your comrades don't get it?

So your first lesson Mr. Howard Fineman, is to stop searching for categories to measure Senator Obama against; like for example Muhammad Ali. Mr. Fineman, you may know Muhammad Ali, but as of today none of us have to the tools to measure the capabilities of "This One". Senator Obama just may take Ali's title as the "The Greatest".