Should Gays Serve in the Military?

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

torqueflite — Thu, 08 Jan 2009 23:44:40 GMT

The U.S. armed forces are intended to protect our country. Personal preferences are left at the door for anyone serving in the military, period. Should a soldier or sailor be allowed to honorably separate if he/she is uncomfortable serving with the opposite sex or with someone of a different race? Females everywhere endure unwanted sexual advances from men; it's amusing that macho males are squeamish about the possibility of suffering what women endure from _them_ daily. Besides, the military code prohibits sexual harassment so the guys have the same options of redress as do their female counterparts. Moreover, whether anyone wants to admit it or not, U.S. wars have ever been an incubator of social change: blacks in the American Civil War, women in WWII. Gays will achieve equality via service in the Iraq War.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

Keeping em honest — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 00:49:48 GMT

"So finally, here's my point: if a major policy change occurs in the military, in fairness, shouldn't those opposed to that change be allowed to honorably separate from service?"

Ridiculous point. Members of the armed forces are not allowed to question their commanders when they are sent into battle. They are not allowed to question their commanders when they are ordered to risk their lives. Why should they be able to not only question their commanders, but to prematurely leave the military over a gay person joining their unit?

I don't believe there is a single member of our armed forces who is actually that scared of a homosexual. Unless, of course, they are insecure in their own sexual identity... but that's another issue. And, as the first point in the article says, other countries do it. I think Americans can handle it.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

disappointed — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 03:06:34 GMT

I think Kurt Soller and his gay buddies should enlist in the military and give up this hopeless dream of becoming a real, unbiased, journalist that Americans used to expect from Newsweek. Newsweek has been overtaken by activists who are using their own political viewpoints to try and shape American opinion. Gays in the military questions should be reserved for those in the military and those tasked with keeping a disciplined, organized force to protect our country and shouldn't become fodder for those that support the gay agenda and look at the military as the last barrier to their acceptance. Kurt, you and your buddy Lisa Miller should be ashamed of yourselves!

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

Mensan John — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 05:25:21 GMT

The 75% poll rating is probably a general population poll; a better guage of acceptabilty of gays in the military would be to survey enlisted men and officers presently serving, or, most recently separately. I was in combat in Vietnam 40 years ago when homosexual men were not allowed into US military service. It was a wise choice then, as it is now. Should gay men want to serve their country, federal civil service jobs are much better paying and offer career paths. Allowing homosexual males in the military could easily lead to group problems, leadership distractions and deaths of other soldiers or the homosexuals. The US military's goals are national defense and requires soldiers to kill and exposure to being killed. Listen to the military's leadership....keep the military gay-free.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

inspired2b — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 05:52:20 GMT

Mensan, I would like to respectfully disagree with your statement: "I was in combat in Vietnam 40 years ago when homosexual men were not allowed into US military service. It was a wise choice then, as it is now." If that was the case that they were not allowed in then how is this the case? http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/11/11/AR2008111102629.html

I served and am Gay and have never had a problem and neither did my fellow servicemen - why? because I never hit on them. What makes people think just because we are gay we are going to hit on our comrades? It is preposterous.

Disappointed - objective journalism is what the world need, because left to others we would never know the truth. Men and women who are gay are well qualified to serve and should serve their country. I've done it and they should too. In the closet or out of the closet what difference does it make?

Keep em honest - I applaud your statement: "I don't believe there is a single member of our armed forces who is actually that scared of a homosexual. " Honestly what is there to be afraid of? They are afraid of a gay person but not bullets that will kill them? You've got to be kidding me.

Everyone listen up, let's let the men and women of our armed forces speak up as Mensan said: a better guage of acceptabilty of gays in the military would be to survey enlisted men and officers presently serving, or, most recently separately." I bet you dollars to donuts that the results will be conclusive YES let them serve. There is a poll on the Military.com site go check out the results: 69% for 25% again and 6% said think about it more.

It's time to repeal - do it now.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

SoulForce1 — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 10:03:51 GMT

As a senior Non-Commissioned Officer in the US Army, I have had the opportunity to serve alongside many gay and lesbian service members over the years. Early in my career I held reservations about homosexuals serving in the ranks. Over time I have come to consider the issue of sexual orientation in the military to be irrelevant. I have consistently found gay and lesbian service members to be among the most highly skilled, motivated, and decorated members of their teams. Perhaps they excel because they have something to prove; an inner drive to show that they are worthy to serve despite their sexual orientation. Regardless, these individuals have shown me that their sexuality is but one aspect of their humanity and that it has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of their character. I firmly believe that every service member, regardless of their sexual orientation, should be evaluated based on their abilities, achievements, and contributions... nothing more, nothing less.

The military brings people from diverse cultural, racial, socioeconomic, and educational backgrounds together and requires them to learn to function cohesively as a team to accomplish difficult and dangerous missions. The armed services have been very successful at integration when leaders initiate diversity training and promote a workplace culture that actively discourages discrimination. Unfortunately, the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy has prevented the military from deploying antidiscrimination programs and policies on behalf of gays and lesbians. By its very existence, the policy has defined the subject of gays and lesbians in the military as a non-issue by refusing to acknowledge the existence of homosexuals within the ranks. The policy has served to further a culture of secrecy that promotes fear and negative stereotypes rather than understanding and tolerance. Service members continue to suffer discrimination, yet must do so silently, for to report it would open the service member to increased scrutiny and expose them to the ultimate discrimination, expulsion from the service. It is not the presence of racial minorities, women, or gays and lesbians in the military that leads to disunity and failed morale; rather, the fault lies in the breakdown of leadership, which creates a culture wherein discrimination thrives.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

cfn50 — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 13:00:21 GMT

Many gays served during the Korean War period without incident except one case of

harassment; a gay SFC hitting on a Pfc.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

Virgoprincess31 — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 15:16:23 GMT

Years ago the issue was "blacks in the military" and people got angry over interracial marriage. Our children read in school about Rosa Parks, Martin Luther King & all the injustices done toward African-Americans. Future generations will look upon us as being sad, prejudiced and unenlightened regarding homosexuality.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

onemindtomany — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 15:39:19 GMT

I am hoping the people commenting are in the military, hopefully recently, on the enlisted side, E-5 or below, and have been overseas, because that is the best way to see how service members feel about gays.

I think gays can serve very well in the military and do great things; however I feel they would be too big of a disturbance to our other troops that serve. Unless gay people become a huge percentage of the military and not just 5% or less, then I don't feel their presence is going to help enough considering the unity that will be offset.

I am very pro gay, and have several siblings that are gay. I am also a Marine (Just picked up E-5) and I have been sent overseas very recently. Many of my fellow Marines can be tolerant people, but most of them just don't like gays and were taught they are bad people. I think this is an ignorant opinion, yet these are the people that are fighting for our country. These are the insane people that see a rain of gun fire and decide it is a good idea to run into it. These are the people who get a kick out of running straight up to a towel head and ripping his head off (sorry for the language but this is how they talk). Even though this might offend you, this is how you win wars. You can't have the normal business mentality of watch what you say and how you treat people when you are out in the battlefield. These guys are top class killing machines and are taught to see human beings as targets that need to be destroyed. The only reason the military works with their hard core rules and "do as I say" policy is because in a high stress environment it works. And in those environments you need to feel comfortable with your fellow comrades, including telling jokes that make fun of all races and sexual orientations. That is just the way it is done. Any Staff or Officer that thinks there is no racial discrimination or sexual harassment is just kidding himself. He has not been around his true grunts or the 90% of the military that is E-5's and below that actually make up the military.

The military is a boy's club and should stay that way. It is what makes these brave men fight to the death and do the crazy things they do to protect our country. The country should turn a blind eye to what is needed to keep our country safe. If we want to treat gays evenly, how about we start with how they are treated in our country currently and give them marriage rights for crying out loud.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

Darren Manzella — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 15:48:29 GMT

As a former Army Sergeant who served openly as a gay soldier in Iraq, I wonder: Were the active duty service members who disagreed with President Truman’s 1948 EO to end segregation “allowed to honorably separate from the service?” The record says no. That isn’t how the military works. Do service members who disagree with the order to take the hill get to disagree and “honorably separate from the service?” Hardly. So why should a different standard apply to integration of gay and lesbian service members? Newsweek cited a discredited, unscientific Military Times poll that claimed a majority of service members oppose open service for gays and lesbians. A number of other scientifically-based polls, however, demonstrate that an unprecedented number of military personnel are now comfortable serving side by side with their gay and lesbian comrades. I believe the tide has turned and all levels and branches of our armed forces are ready for open service regardless of sexual orientation, and so do the majority of the young service members I served along with in Iraq (twice). To learn more, visit Servicemembers Legal Defense Network at www.sldn.org.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

Jim173 — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 17:02:37 GMT

The solution is the age-old military one: you salute, say "yes, sir" and implement the policy directive. And as part of their tranition to the new, out-of-the-closet way of doing business you do at least two additional things:

1. Provide everyone a list of the Fortune 1000 companies that include sexual orientation in their harrassment and non-dsicrimination orkplace policies, and

2. Ask them, "Where ya gonna go, dude?".

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

abates75 — Fri, 09 Jan 2009 17:50:36 GMT

I've always been against the exclusion of gays in the military. If a person is committed enough to join the military and put their life on the line, then orientation, as well as race, shouldn't compromise another's dedication to the military. If it does then that person was not dedicated to the service of their country in the first place.

Homosexuals have adapted for thousands of years, aware that their orientation can bring out the worst in bigoted heterosexuals. The assumption that gay men and women will be flauting their lifestyle in front of straight men and women is in itself bigoted. This same argument of showing up and infecting the majority, in its various forms, has always been used to keep a certain race, religion, ethnicity, sexual orientation, sex, etc., ostricized. As we have witnessed throughout human history, once a minority has been accepted by the majority and given the same opportunities as the majority, they begin to regress to the mean. The reason homosexuals "flaunt" their lifestyle now is because a majority of people believe and view that lifestyle as abnormal.

If openly gay men or women were allowed to admit their sexual orientation there may be a few that want to react negatively, but as time passes by, those people that are dedicated to the armed services will realize the sacrifice that a gay person is offering for their country is exactly the same sacrifice that heterosexuals offer. That sacrifice is what causes comraderie and "brotherhood", not one's personal beliefs.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

jandmamck — Tue, 27 Jan 2009 23:27:30 GMT

The very fact that "straights" are attracted to and by " straights", and that "non straights" are attracted to and by "non straights" should be conclusive evidence that a "to each his/her own" philosophy be understood and be implemented, so that both can enjoy their sexual orientation without interference or concern by the other. Forced integration of the two types of people can only cause resentment and revolt. Allow each person of the same persuasion to live with their own personal orientation. Can each type serve in the military? Of course, but separate from each other. This could mean gays serve with gays and straights serve with straights. It would cause many great concern and probably court martials in their efforts to be left with their own kind. If you have not been accosted by or leered at by gays or lesbiens you have not felt the pain and discomfort of unwelcome and to "straights", unnatural advances and gestures.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

WTL=JC — Mon, 02 Feb 2009 15:59:25 GMT

harley if you are so against the views of christians then why are you reading the bible? ( just a thought) for the record christians are not the aggresors here. gays and gay activist are. do you think were just going to sit back and let you force your ungodly marriages into our churches and teach our kids in school that gay is ok. no certainly not. thats where it ends for you. we would be sinning if we gave into that. and while you were reading in your bible did you happen to read the part on marriaige. where it said a man and woman should come as one.did you also read the part about the sodemites in the old testament? i guess you forgot to mention that in your article right. please dont tell me what to read in my bible. especially when you obviously havent read the entire bible yourself. if your going to cling to those verses at least read the rest. then will talk.

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

GLUAD_STAFF — Mon, 09 Feb 2009 23:23:06 GMT

Sadly many of our members of the community that are LGBT (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender) feel as if they are no longer an American. For many reasons such as, their rights are being banned. Just a few rights that are being confiscated would include Marriage, Domestic Partnership, Disability benefits, health benefits, and so much more. Statically, over 1138 rights are banned just because a person(s) is "homosexual" Youth that are homosexual are up the four times more likely to successfully attempt suicide then their heterosexual peers! Hate crimes are a huge outcome of someone's hatred to someone's sexual orientation (ex: The Matthew Shepard Story ; Prayers for Bobby). LGBT couples DO NOT have the legal right to visit a spouse in the hospital and can be barred from entering the room by any medical staff/personnel. The LGBT community also faces critical issues such as being unable to make medical decisions. In other words, they have no legal authority to make critical treatment decisions for their loved one, even if they are seconds away from dying. One that is homosexual can't ask or receive domestic violence protection orders.

I am hearing stories from others saying they are being harassed, abused, neglected, and so much more! I also found that many of us are afraid to express ourselves, because we are uncertain of the outcome in which one may respond to us being ourselves. Hate crimes are a huge issue that we face along with harassment. On record according to the FBI's statistics in just the year of 2007, over a thousand reported hate crime offenses were committed JUST in cause of someone's sexual-orientation. That number will only continue to rise and increase if we do not immediately take action. Statistically speaking, many hate crimes based on someone's sexual orientation are un-reported. Also many of the members of the LGBT community commit suicide, because they are always put down, and they feel no need to live as they are discriminated upon, and frequently abused or beaten by the community that has negative views on the LGBT community. Sadly LGBT youth are up to four times more likely to successfully attempt suicide than their heterosexual peers! Our gay community is and should be part of the one community called "Americans" Whether you be African American, Hispanic, Christian, Gay, Straight, or Disabled. We are all citizens, better yet human. As citizens of the United States of America we all have freedom and the right to express ourselves, as our rights are guaranteed in our state, and United States Constitutional Amendments. Banning these rights and marriage between the LGBT community, is absolutely discriminating, un-constitutional, and unjust! Rights should not be taken away from any individual because of their race, gender, sexual orientation, religion, etc. A very heartrending memory back in history, not too long ago when the Caucasian race was treated better then the African American race. Is that honestly the definition of freedom and equality? Now with the LGBT community we are repeating history and facing some of those habits and problem once again. Currently, one of the main changes would be that it's discriminating on someone's sexual orientation, rather then their race. I feel that this issue can be changed as we can re-solve this problem as a community, working together! We need to make our schools, offices, and all public places more friendly towards all people, no matter what someone's sexual orientation is, and so forth. This is a very important issue, that must be acted upon now, before more of our community and citizens are injured, commit suicide, or get brought down, and lose their self confidence.

--Team Members @ Gay & Lesbians United Against Discrimination

re: Should Gays Serve in the Military?

KizunaKurogane — Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:18:11 GMT

As a response to WTL=JC: Really? Gays are forcing others to become gay? Honestly, as a person with many gay, lesbian, and bisexual friends, I have never had any of them force themselves on me. They show respect towards you. You should do the same. Also, read about King David and Jonathan.