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Posted Friday, October 03, 2008 12:03 AM

The Tale of Two Debates

Andrew Romano

First things first: they both survived.

For accuracy's sake, though, we should probably consider referring to tonight's "Showdown in St. Louis" as the "Showdowns in St. Louis." It was the Tale of Two Debates. In one ring we watched Sarah Palin battling Tina Fey's impression of Sarah Palin. In the other we saw Joe Biden jousting with John McCain. They both delivered somewhat uneven performances--but both "won" their individual bouts. The question is which one moved his or her boss closer to victory on Nov. 4.

Palin's plan was simple: deliver your talking points and pivot to an attack on Barack Obama--regardless of what moderator Gwen Ifill asks. The results of this strategy were mixed. For one thing, Palin's frequent attempts to bait Biden into making one of his famous "gaffes" or saying something "condescending"--she repeatedly sought to provoke his ire by pointing out issues (i.e., Iraq war funding, experience) on which he and Obama have parted ways in the past--did not succeed. Not only did Biden resist the temptation to pull a Lazio and charge her podium, but he delivered crisp, clear ripostes that began with the words "that charge is not true" instead of, say, "Governor Palin is lying." Biden was so focused on being polite, in fact, that the one time he said "Sarah," he immediately reverted to "Governor." That said, Palin did manage to keep her rival on the defensive--especially on raising taxes--for substantial stretches of the debate. That's always a plus.

Palin was her strongest, though, when transitioning from the topic at hand to a folksy, emotive talking point--an attempt, as she put it, "to talk straight to the American people and let 'em know my track record" regardless of what "[Biden] or the moderator want to hear." When Ifill tried to steer the conversation to Capitol Hill, for example--did we see the "worst of Washington or the best of Washington... play out" in recent Congressional jockeying over the bailout bill?--Palin detoured to the soccer field: "You know, I think a good barometer here... is to go to a kid's soccer game on Saturday, and turn to any parent there on the sideline and ask them, 'How are you feeling about the economy?' And I'll bet you, you're going to hear some fear in that parent's voice." To practiced ears, "soccer" sounded like a line that Palin had memorized and repeated. But for voters who'd only seen her fumbling through the Katie Couric interviews--or had only seen SNL satirizing her fumbles--Palin sounded clear enough, compelling enough and common-sensical enough to come across as a competent public figure (as opposed to a caricature of incompetence). Throughout the debate, she reverted to this mode again and again, mentioning her "Joe Six-Pack" roots in "Middle America" one minute and admitting that it was time to stop "fingerpointing" and move past Bush's "blunders" the next. It was the main reason she "exceeded expectations."

The problem for Palin, however, was that she often seemed to run out of (or simply spew out) talking points--at which point her answers would disintegrate into the confusing "blizzards of words" that Charlie Gibson recently endured. Asked about the causes of climate change, for example, the Alaskan seemed unable to muster an intelligible response. "I'm not one to attribute every man--activity of man to the changes in the climate," she said. "There is something to be said also for man's activities, but also for the cyclical temperature changes on our planet.... What I want to argue about is, how are we going to get there to positively affect the impacts?" Asked what circumstances would force her to deploy America’s nuclear weaponry, Palin chose to answer a different question. “Nuclear weaponry, of course, would be the be-all, end-all of just too many people in too many parts of our planet," she said. "So those dangerous regimes, again, cannot be allowed to acquire nuclear weapons, period.” And her riff on Israel was similarly scrambled:

A two-state solution is the solution. And Secretary Rice, having recently met with leaders on one side or the other there, also, still in these waning days of the Bush administration, trying to forge that peace, and that needs to be done, and that will be top of an agenda item, also, under a McCain-Palin administration. Israel is our strongest and best ally in the Middle East. We have got to assure them that we will never allow a second Holocaust, despite, again, warnings from Iran and any other country that would seek to destroy Israel, that that is what they would like to see. 

There was an argument in there somewhere. But it was buried amid a pile-up of talking points.

This isn't to say Palin bombed. Far from it. Over the course of 90 minutes, she sounded smart, savvy and spunky enough, often enough, to seem to belong on stage--and to give commentators the grist they needed to call it a comeback. (That's why she's better suited to debates than network interviews: no filter, plenty of time.) But there were simply too many of these "huh?" moments--especially near the end of the event--to convince the 60 percent of voters who told ABC News this week that Palin is unprepared for the presidency that they're mistaken. Her trajectory tonight mirrored her trajectory since St. Paul--solid at the start, shakier over time. In St. Louis, Palin proved she can be an able communicator--and prevented herself from becoming a perpetual punchline. But I doubt that she convinced many skeptical swing voters that she's qualified to lead the free world.

This readiness deficit redounds to Biden's--and by extension Obama's--benefit. Biden didn't have a perfect night. His performance seemed to veer from muted to blustery, and it took him half an hour to find his footing. But he never seemed arrogant, condescending or chauvinistic. He never blathered on endlessly. And he certainly never put his foot in his mouth. More importantly, Biden did what he came to do--make a clear case against John McCain. And he did it with answers that were more detailed, less rhetorical and far more responsive to the questions than Palin's. You may disagree with his arguments. Many will. But it's impossible to say he wasn't polite, persuasive and well-informed. In fact, he even out-emoted Palin, silently fighting back tears while recalling his son’s near-death after the horrific car accident that killed his wife and daughter in 1972. People are "looking for help," he said, choking up. "They're not looking for more of the same."

Ultimately, partisans will ignore the errors and find much to cheer in each candidate's performance. But when it comes to the all-important swing voters, Biden may have the edge. Unlike pundits, undecideds don't come equipped with unique, finely-calibrated expectations for each candidate. Unlike partisans, they're not preconditioned to support the politician who flatters their ideological biases. They're just looking for the most plausible president--or in this case, vice president. Palin delivered an appealing performance. But I suspect that undecideds will see Biden as more vice-presidential.

So far, the surveys seem to support my hunch. CNN's quick-release poll gave the debate to the Delaware senator, 51 percent to 36 percent, and 46 percent of undecided voters surveyed by CBS News agreed (21 percent thought Palin won). Palin's problem wasn't likability: 54 percent of CNN respondents picked Palin in that category; only 36 percent chose Biden. It was preparedness. In fact, the debate didn't move Palin's readiness meter one iota: 54 percent of voters said she wasn't qualified to be president before the debate, and 53 percent said the same thing afterwards. Are these stats the final say? Hardly. But even if the voters ultimately decide that the Showdowns in St. Louis were a draw, there's no chance that they'll prove impactful enough to alter the basic contours of the race. Right now, Obama leads by an average of six points and has broken 50 percent in several polls--with only 33 days to go. For McCain, a tie won't do the trick.

In other words, survival is all well and good. But it's not the same thing as winning.

UPDATE, Oct. 3: For an analysis of each candidate's factual missteps, click here.
 

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Member Comments

Posted By: haynessemperfi (October 18, 2008 at 2:25 AM)

PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE TO BE HELD SUNDAY AT COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY

The Free and Equal Elections Coalition (FREE) and the Columbia Political Union are pleased to announce that a Presidential debate will be held this coming Sunday, October 19th, 2008, on the campus of Columbia University.

ALL SIX of the Presidential candidates who appear on enough state ballots to acquire the 270 Electoral Votes needed to become President are invited. They are as follows (listed in alphabetical order by affiliation):

Constitution Party Candidate: Chuck Baldwin

Democratic Party Candidate: Barack Obama

Green Party Candidate: Cynthia McKinney

Independent Candidate: Ralph Nader

Libertarian Party Candidate: Bob Barr

Republican Party Can John McCain

The Columbia Political Union will present the debate from 8:00pm to 10:00pm in the Altschul Auditorium, located at 417 International Affairs Building. The debate will be moderated by Pacifica Radio's Amy Goodman, the host of "Democracy Now!". CSPAN will cover the debate, and live radio broadcasts are expected.

"The Columbia Political Union is committed to energizing political discourse on Columbia's campus," said Allon Brann, Columbia Political Union Publisher. "As a non-partisan organization, we work to provide students with opportunities to encounter and engage with political ideas across a wide ideological spectrum, and on a wide range of issues."

"It is with these goals in mind that we have organized this Presidential Debate: to give all candidates-- either within or outside of the political "mainstream"-- the opportunity to speak directly to students about their goals on the issues they deem critical for this country."

"We have invited all eligible candidates, and it is our sincere hope that all will participate, to ensure the substance and rigor of the dialogue which we believe is crucial at this time."

Certified letters officially inviting each candidate have been sent to the respective campaigns.

The Free and Equal Elections Coalition and the Columbia Political Union await the response from the candidates. All candidates' supporters are encouraged to contact the Presidential campaigns and urge them to attend.

The Columbia Political Union seeks to enhance involvement in the political process, domestic and international, and draw every member of the campus community into an ongoing discussion of political ideas.

FREE is a coalition of political parties, independent citizens and civic organizations formed to promote free and equal elections in the United States.

http://www.freeandequal.org/events.php?id=7

FREEDOM ISN'T FREE


Posted By: Jim Johnson (October 16, 2008 at 1:07 PM)

Obama's view of the future of America - Socialism which is the next step to Communism!!

Under socialism a ruling class of intellectuals, bureaucrats and social planners decide what people want or what is good for society and then use the coercive power of the State to regulate, tax, and redistribute the wealth of those who work for a living. In other words, socialism is a form of legalized theft.

The morality of socialism can be summed-up in two words: envy and self-sacrifice. Envy is the desire to not only possess another's wealth but also the desire to see another's wealth lowered to the level of one's own. Socialism's teaching on self-sacrifice was nicely summarized by two of its greatest defenders, Hermann Goering and Bennito Mussolini. The highest principle of Nazism (National Socialism), said Goering, is: "Common good comes before private good." Fascism, said

Mussolini, is "a life in which the individual, through the sacrifice of his own private interests??realizes that completely spiritual existence in which his value as a man lies."

Socialism is the social system which institutionalizes envy and self-sacrifice: It is the social system which uses compulsion and the organized violence of the State to expropriate wealth from the producer class for its redistribution to the parasitical class.

Despite the intellectuals' psychotic hatred of capitalism, it is the only moral and just social system.

Capitalism is the only moral system because it requires human beings to deal with one another as traders--that is, as free moral agents trading and selling goods and services on the basis of mutual consent.

Capitalism is the only just system because the sole criterion that determines the value of thing exchanged is the free, voluntary, universal judgement of the consumer. Coercion and fraud are anathema to the free-market system.

It is both moral and just because the degree to which man rises or falls in society is determined by the degree to which he uses his mind. Capitalism is the only social system that rewards merit, ability and achievement, regardless of one's birth or station in life.

Yes, there are winners and losers in capitalism. The winners are those who are honest, industrious, thoughtful, prudent, frugal, responsible, disciplined, and efficient. The losers are those who are shiftless, lazy, imprudent, extravagant, negligent, impractical, and inefficient. [What about the role of luck­being in the right place at the right time or the wrong place at the wrong time? R. R. Pope}

Capitalism is the only social system that rewards virtue and punishes vice. This applies to both the business executive and the carpenter, the lawyer and the factory worker.


Posted By: haynessemperfi (October 14, 2008 at 1:50 PM)

It’s remarkable that McCain and Obama agree on the Wall Street bailout, increasing the military, civil liberties restrictions (Patriot Act re-authorization, FISA), corporate trade deals, support for Israel, increased militarization of Afghanistan, threats (”all options on the table”) against Iran, against a single-payer health care system. On many of these issues, they are opposed by a majority of the U.S. public and most of the main independent and third party candidates. Yet, because most of the public is stuck in partisan boxes and the big media outlets have refused to cover non-establishment candidates, they remain in single digits. This of course is the problem VotePact solves.

It unfairly ignores Chuck Baldwin and has a number of flaws, but IndyKids still puts mainstream media to shame in breaking down some of the positions of various candidates, esp see their PDF newspaper, though the type is a little small. Reminds me of Jesus saying of children: “the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.” Would be happy to link to other breakdowns of positions of various candidates.

Also, the Political Compass gives their assessment of the various 2008 presidential candidates along their two-dimensional axis. Some of their analysis is dubious in my view, but they make some worthwhile comments:

While Cynthia McKinney and Ralph Nader are depicted on the extreme left in an American context, they would simply be mainstream social democrats within the wider political landscape of Europe [to say nothing of the rest of the planet]. Similarly, Obama is popularly perceived as a leftist in the United States while elsewhere in the west his record is that of a moderate conservative. For example, in the case of the death penalty he is not an uncompromising abolitionist, while mainstream conservatives in all other western democracies are deeply opposed to capital punishment. The Democratic party’s presidential candidate also reneged on his commitment to oppose the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. He sided with the ultra conservative bloc in the Supreme Court against the Washington DC handgun ban and for capital punishment in child rape cases. He supports President Bush’s faith-based initiatives and is reported in Fortune to have said that NAFTA isn’t so bad.

It’s not at all transparent how Political Compass determined the placement of the candidates on their chart. They list Baldwin and Barr as surprisingly close to McCain. It’s not clear if they are taking stated positions of politicians at face value — Biden says he’s against the Iraq war, but voted for it and voted for funding it, for example, Barr somewhat similarly states positions today very different than what he has voted for — or if they are extracting stances based on the candidate’s record.

www.votepact.org

www.votenader.org